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Author Topic: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be  (Read 40913 times)

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Offline fastesthonda_jim

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #90 on: December 02, 2017, 09:39:45 PM »
Dodge, Sparky, you figured me out.  Actually I had thought I had all the answers, but thought it would be prudent to see if there was a counter argument that provided a 100% solution while still going West to East.
Desotoman - yes we may still have the errant kid problem, but 1. the Big End would be further from the public, and 2. something that hasn't been mentioned here yet - the return road would now be on the south side, also further away from the public.  MANY MANY of the support crews excitedly hammer it down the return road, a few hitting 35mph+ even after they've have been notified on the CB (that they forgot to turn up/on).  You have to also consider that the errant kid would be taken out by a support crew.  What are you going to do to slow them down?  Nothing has worked so far.  Do we do speed bumps?  Take away records?  Have a license up procedure for push truck drivers?  Or what?  Again most of those solutions are after the infraction or demand more time, and money from someone..
MM not to worry about landing on private property.  As a "favor" to the racers, a few years back the BLM installed a "full Width" catch fence across that end of the lake
mtib - yes the wind would tend to blow dust onto the staging lanes.
Okay back to y'all (yes, even you, Sparky)

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Offline grumm441

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #91 on: December 02, 2017, 11:18:32 PM »
Why don't you use the Retention of Vehicle / and or parts rule
Change the rule to read incident instead of accident
Someone runs out the backdoor, it's an incident and just hang on to their vehicle until you work out what happened
I know it seems harsh, however, having no place to run time trails seems a lot harsher
G
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Offline Beef Stew

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #92 on: December 02, 2017, 11:32:41 PM »
No-one wants to give-up El Mirage Horsepower, aka as a tailwind. So running East to West isn't going to fly.

Why is it that when Jim Loving got dusted a while back, he dumped the laundry? Would everyone have done the same-thing? Would others have tried to out-run the dust?

What you have is a people problem. As Nortonist 592 has said:
Quote
Tell that to Dannenfeltzer.   He can stop quicker from 250+ than most of the 100 mph cars.
Why is that? Do you think that maybe the sharp guys don't have problems because they are still sharp? In pro racing if you lose a step, you either retire, or are forced out by the lack of a ride. In hobby-racing you can stick-around until you kill yourself, or an out-house  :-o Dementia isn't something that the old like to talk about, but it happens—and it need to be discussed.

Back to you Jim.
Former record holder at RIR ½ mile drags, El Mirage and Bonneville.

Beef Stew doesn't have his head where the sun-don't-shine. His head is in SoCal where the unusual is an everyday happening.

Offline sofadriver

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #93 on: December 03, 2017, 07:35:33 AM »
What do the on-site BLM folks have to say when these incidents have occurred?
Can they write tickets to offenders?
Mike in Tacoma

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Offline jww36

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #94 on: December 03, 2017, 10:53:31 AM »
Hey guys, it's so frick'in simple. Allow the BLM to give us more lakebed. It's a win-win. It will be safer for everyone and there is plenty of lakebed for off road enthusiasts.

Offline Stan Back

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #95 on: December 03, 2017, 12:00:23 PM »
It's always amazed me that hundreds bring their long-travel off-road vehicles out to El Mirage to ride all day on a flat surface.

Why does the BLM turn their backs when race vehicles are run during the week there.  Yes, we all know that happens.  Is it because of less personnel to oversee weekday traffic?

I could be wrong (me?), but as I see it, most fatalities at El Mirage are results of ultra-light crashes.  And they don't have "run-down" areas.
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Offline Beef Stew

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #96 on: December 03, 2017, 04:02:00 PM »
What do the on-site BLM folks have to say when these incidents have occurred?
Can they write tickets to offenders?

Most federal bureaucracies have law enforcement divisions. The USForest service has armed Law Enforcement Rangers, with full police powers. The Forest Service LERs also have helicopters that they use for patrol. Since 1976 the BLM also has Law Enforcement Rangers https://www.blm.gov/nhp/pubs/brochures/law/index.htm

Could a BLM Law Enforcement Ranger arresting a backdoor violator, handcuffing them and taking them to the local lockup be a deterrent?  A better deterrent than any SCTA issued penalty could ever be?
Former record holder at RIR ½ mile drags, El Mirage and Bonneville.

Beef Stew doesn't have his head where the sun-don't-shine. His head is in SoCal where the unusual is an everyday happening.

Offline jl222

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #97 on: December 03, 2017, 04:13:06 PM »
What do the on-site BLM folks have to say when these incidents have occurred?
Can they write tickets to offenders?

Most federal bureaucracies have law enforcement divisions. The USForest service has armed Law Enforcement Rangers, with full police powers. The Forest Service LERs also have helicopters that they use for patrol. Since 1976 the BLM also has Law Enforcement Rangers https://www.blm.gov/nhp/pubs/brochures/law/index.htm

Could a BLM Law Enforcement Ranger arresting a backdoor violator, handcuffing them and taking them to the local lockup be a deterrent?  A better deterrent than any SCTA issued penalty could ever be?

  What's in that stew?

                     JL222

Offline Beef Stew

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #98 on: December 03, 2017, 04:29:44 PM »
It's always amazed me that hundreds bring their long-travel off-road vehicles out to El Mirage to ride all day on a flat surface.

During the 1960s Honda ran a You meet the nicest people on a Honda advertising campaign. Soon it wasn't just patch-holders riding motorcycles—non-scooter-tramps were riding Hondas, Kawasaki, Suzukis  and Yamahas. All of a sudden most SCTA tow vehicle had a bed full of dirt bikes. It didn't take long before these bikes were interfering with the racing. Soon after the SCTA board issued rules to help control the problem :)

Stan Back, you really haven't lived until you've ridden a Triumph desert-sled through a pucker-bush at speed :) Been there and done that  :-D
Former record holder at RIR ½ mile drags, El Mirage and Bonneville.

Beef Stew doesn't have his head where the sun-don't-shine. His head is in SoCal where the unusual is an everyday happening.

Offline Beef Stew

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #99 on: December 03, 2017, 04:40:43 PM »

  What's in that stew?

                     JL222

Dinty Moore Beef Stew is a favorite survival food of American Preppers. It has beef cubes. salty gravy and lots of fat. What's not to like  :-D
Former record holder at RIR ½ mile drags, El Mirage and Bonneville.

Beef Stew doesn't have his head where the sun-don't-shine. His head is in SoCal where the unusual is an everyday happening.

Offline jl222

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #100 on: December 03, 2017, 05:24:36 PM »

  What's in that stew?

                     JL222

Dinty Moore Beef Stew is a favorite survival food of American Preppers. It has beef cubes. salty gravy and lots of fat. What's not to like  :-D

  You or somebody must have added something.

         JL222

         

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #101 on: December 03, 2017, 06:21:03 PM »
Could a BLM Law Enforcement Ranger arresting a backdoor violator, handcuffing them and taking them to the local lockup be a deterrent?  A better deterrent than any SCTA issued penalty could ever be?

Likely wouldn't be the first time something similar has happened to some of us.    :oops:

If one believes that laws create deterrence incentives, that might just be the "ticket".

Paying a lawyer to go to Bakersfield - or Los Angeles - or Sacramento - usually the feds get to pick which court they argue in - to fight a Federal misdemeanor charge and the possibility of further Federal Government entanglement?  I'd check my brakes and be sure I wasn't flying blind.

"Yes, your honor, I was driving flat out, but the dust was so bad, I couldn't see where to stop.  Then my parachute didn't deploy properly, and my brakes - well, they couldn't hold a baby buggy on a 4% grade . . ."

Of course, then the question becomes "which statute" - or "statutes" - and the possibility of an unsympathetic judge shutting down the whole operation.  Hemmings reported six instances in November - that would go into a court record as well, likely implicating SCTA.

Either way, the vehicle remains in an impound not overseen by "the Mayor", and it's not free parking.

Probably best to keep it "in house" - but in order to do that, it's probably best to stay "in bounds".

I think that if the current direction - while safer for the drivers and riders - puts unwaivered bystanders at risk, then switching the direction AWAY from the bystanders is a responsible change, and in this case, provides a heightened awareness on the part of those who have signed up to take the risk, and eliminates the possibility of overshooting into areas the BLM doesn't want us in. 
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

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Offline Beef Stew

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #102 on: December 03, 2017, 06:55:24 PM »

You or somebody must have added something.

         JL222

It wasn't me.

sofadriver asked:
Quote
Can they write tickets to offenders?

I have some experience with Forest Service LERs. Myself and several other civilians were working on a trail restoration project in the Angeles National Forest. Some dirt-bikers arrived and started using their spinning rear tire to cause more damage. The Ranger we were working for was dissed when he tried stopping them. Not to worry, he got on his radio. Several minuets later two armed Law Enforcement Rangers arrived in their chopper. End of story.

In the real-world insulting me has no real consequences. Please re-read what Milwaukee Midget has to say about the BLM.
Former record holder at RIR ½ mile drags, El Mirage and Bonneville.

Beef Stew doesn't have his head where the sun-don't-shine. His head is in SoCal where the unusual is an everyday happening.

Offline jl222

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #103 on: December 03, 2017, 07:14:00 PM »

You or somebody must have added something.

         JL222

It wasn't me.

sofadriver asked:
Quote
Can they write tickets to offenders?

I have some experience with Forest Service LERs. Myself and several other civilians were working on a trail restoration project in the Angeles National Forest. Some dirt-bikers arrived and started using their spinning rear tire to cause more damage. The Ranger we were working for was dissed when he tried stopping them. Not to worry, he got on his radio. Several minuets later two armed Law Enforcement Rangers arrived in their chopper. End of story.

In the real-world insulting me has no real consequences. Please re-read what Milwaukee Midget has to say about the BLM.

  Must have been a flat spot in the forest for the chopper to land and the bikers were in the flat spot to and you saw it happen?

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: El Mirage – To Be or Not To Be
« Reply #104 on: December 03, 2017, 07:44:12 PM »
 JL222 - What do you think could be done to solve the problem of people running out the back door?
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!