Author Topic: Bockscar 2.0  (Read 84574 times)

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Offline Stainless1

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Bockscar 2.0
« on: October 03, 2017, 09:59:00 PM »
Well I have been thinking about putting a new frame in the Bockscar for several years.  Pork Pie started working on new canopy and top drawings to eliminate the engine bumps.  The old frame held up quite well for one that was out there for the first time 41 years ago.   The helmets outgrew the cage we installed in 1984.... we redid it... but they seem to be headed that way again, so the cage will grow a little with the top. 

Since the accident I have been trying to decide if we really want to build another car from scratch... and spend half my retirement money... with the salt in such a questionable condition.... and I have decided no!

That's no to spending half the retirement.... I think I can do it on 30%... going to reuse as much of the old car as possible.  Will it be ready for SW18? Couldn't tell ya

I have to start this by saying thanks to my first sponsor Sparky Bill Smith, he gave me the 20 ft long 29 inch wide build table he had stashed in his back yard.  I picked it up after WoS on my way home.  It needed to be mobile, so I put wheels on it, then it needed to be stable so I put retractable legs on it so it won't rotate unless I want it to. 
Started welding and squaring up fixtures on it today so I can put some pipe on it soon
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, MSA Bockscar Lakester with a little N20 
MSA Bockscar Lakester #1000 my fastest mile 245 and change, 84 ci turbobusa motor... but Corey's 233 MPH H/BFL record is still 3MPH faster than mine.

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #1 on: October 03, 2017, 10:51:22 PM »
YES!
I'll pick up some lubricant for you . . . :cheers:
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

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Offline Speed Limit 1000

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #2 on: October 03, 2017, 11:16:53 PM »
Looking good. The shop floor looks clean :cheers:
John Gowetski, red hat @ 221.183 MPH MSA Lakester, Bockscar #1000 60 ci normally aspirated w/N20

Offline Peter Jack

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #3 on: October 03, 2017, 11:48:06 PM »
That's a nice looking jig. You should be able to build something really nice using that. Good luck!

Pete

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2017, 06:22:30 AM »
YES!
I'll pick up some lubricant for you . . . :cheers:

Bob,

Hmmmm . . . . .   66 huh?   Same age as I am, so I have some suggestions:

A/   DO NOT let the build budget negatively impact your suds budget.   Seriously, there have to be: PRIORITIES

2/   Refining/updating the design seems like a smart idea to me.   I'm thinkin' you are not going to want to do this over because of some small unconsidered detail.

d/   Another member of our "66" club, Tom Petty, has recently departed to places "unknown".    I'd say: "Git 'er done!!"   After all, we are all "walking wounded" at this age . . . . . .

As always, if you need anything from me, you know how to get a hold of me.    Even if it is just an infusion of "Dragon's Milk" . . . . . .

 :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
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Offline Stainless1

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2017, 09:19:31 PM »
FB, not to worry, that 20% is my lubrication budget...  :roll: so I can't really count it against the car. 
Usually spend most of my money on racing, women and booze.... and waste the rest...

So I have decided to build the front 140 inches of the car (less the nose) first, that will be front suspension, drivers area, engine bay and rear suspension mounts.  Hoping to not screw it up, we have been refining this thing for 33 years.  I know I want 2 or 3 more inches of climb in room, for the knees that are not getting any younger.... or more agile...
I am trying to figure out how to make an engine mount that just installs the mount and engine in the bay to eliminate the major fight we have getting engines in and out.... it may include the removable frame rail or not... time will tell if I can figure it out. 

I will make all the curved parts and weld them to the 24 X 16 rectangular section later. 
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, MSA Bockscar Lakester with a little N20 
MSA Bockscar Lakester #1000 my fastest mile 245 and change, 84 ci turbobusa motor... but Corey's 233 MPH H/BFL record is still 3MPH faster than mine.

Offline WOODY@DDLLC

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2017, 07:30:34 AM »
George Burns once said something to the effect, "My doctor said I had to give up women, booze and cigars! Worst five minutes of my life! That doctor has been dead for 15 years now!"  :-o :-D :cheers:
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Offline floydjer

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2017, 08:03:50 AM »
Excellent idea on the wheels...the only thing is my shop that isn`t on wheels are my cars..........
I`d never advocate drugs,alcohol,violence or insanity to anyone...But they work for me.

Offline manta22

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2017, 10:56:50 AM »
FB, not to worry, that 20% is my lubrication budget...  :roll: so I can't really count it against the car. 
Usually spend most of my money on racing, women and booze.... and waste the rest...

So I have decided to build the front 140 inches of the car (less the nose) first, that will be front suspension, drivers area, engine bay and rear suspension mounts.  Hoping to not screw it up, we have been refining this thing for 33 years.  I know I want 2 or 3 more inches of climb in room, for the knees that are not getting any younger.... or more agile...
I am trying to figure out how to make an engine mount that just installs the mount and engine in the bay to eliminate the major fight we have getting engines in and out.... it may include the removable frame rail or not... time will tell if I can figure it out. 

I will make all the curved parts and weld them to the 24 X 16 rectangular section later. 

Since you are building a new chassis, consider putting the rear engine & drivetrain in a section of the chassis that will break off from the rest in a hard crash. Getting rid of the energy in a heavy component like that will allow the section with the cockpit to come to a safer stop.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

Offline Stan Back

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2017, 03:46:29 PM »
Is that how the Manta is?
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Offline tortoise

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2017, 04:42:09 PM »
Since you are building a new chassis, consider putting the rear engine & drivetrain in a section of the chassis that will break off from the rest in a hard crash. Getting rid of the energy in a heavy component like that will allow the section with the cockpit to come to a safer stop.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

One might think that the mass of the drivetrain, if still firmly attached, would slow the deceleration of the vehicle upon impact, and limit damage to that bag of bones and water inside the roll cage.

Offline NathanStewart

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2017, 05:08:19 PM »
F=MA.  Reduce the mass and you reduce the force.  I think the benefits of a break away chassis is fairly well understood and adopted in a few different forms of motorsports.

Stainless, Bockscar has always been one of my favorite cars for as long as I could remember - Ben Jordan was an early and great influence on me and my brother.  I'm glad you're bringing it back and hope you can maintain a majority of it's original form.  Looking forward to seeing it out on the salt again.
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Offline tortoise

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2017, 05:45:17 PM »
F=MA.  Reduce the mass and you reduce the force. 

F=MA. Reduce the mass and you increase the acceleration. Lighter vehicles are easier on things they run into, but that's not the issue here.

Offline manta22

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2017, 06:11:10 PM »
Is that how the Manta is?

Yes, Stan. My chassis is designed to separate between the rear of the roll cage structure and the chassis members that contain the engine, transaxle, and rear suspension & tires. I like the idea of the heavy stuff bouncing along separately from the part with me in it. In a mid- or rear-engine layout this is feasible; a front engine, not so much.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

Offline manta22

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Re: Bockscar 2.0
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2017, 06:14:36 PM »
Since you are building a new chassis, consider putting the rear engine & drivetrain in a section of the chassis that will break off from the rest in a hard crash. Getting rid of the energy in a heavy component like that will allow the section with the cockpit to come to a safer stop.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

One might think that the mass of the drivetrain, if still firmly attached, would slow the deceleration of the vehicle upon impact, and limit damage to that bag of bones and water inside the roll cage.

Actually, it is just the opposite- the heavier pieces have more energy; that must be dissipated so they tumble down the course further.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ