Newbie with 1954 Studebaker - which class is best bang for the buck?

[floydjer]

Flipper..maybe you could post a pic or two of Roofus for those who are not familiar w/ him

[Eddieschopshop]

Nah quit messing around and just go AA Blown CC that is where the fun is.

[NathanStewart]

The TURBO Toyota 2JZ is your friend in this area.

Made your statement more accurate Dan.  The 2JZ really isn't that great a motor in NA form but they really strut their stuff with lots of BOOOOOOOST.  A Juicewic/Cohn F motor would wipe the floor with a non turbo 2JZ.

Flip, my best suggestion (and not to be a dream killer) is to forget about a record.  Just build something that you can go run and have fun with.  IMO the 130/150 stuff doesn't cut it.  It's fun I guess but it really doesn't take that much to build a car that'll safely go 150-175mph.  There's a guy that runs his weekend Studebaker street car at Bonneville with a SBC and auto trans.  We limit him to 150 or 175 and he goes out and makes his run and has fun and then goes home.  If he wants to go faster, he'll have to get more serious about building a real, dedicated race car ($$$$) but in the mean time, he's making runs on the salt while you're not.  Records are not easy and aren't for the casual salt racer.  If people only ran to get records, not very many people would run. 

If you really want a record, then you better be very good at building and tuning a particular engine combo that you know is going to go out and slay records.  I'm guessing that won't include any engine classes between AA-E.  Those are super, super competitive engine classes.  And BTW, it's really not about the cars being competitive but the engine.  Might want to make friends with an engine builder who wants to go Bonneville racing. 

[gnomenator]

Hey there Flipper, welcome to the 'club', I was in the same boat you are in, I have a 53 Stude and wanted to do the LSR thing. The wife and I came as spectators in 07  and NEVER looked back! I built a '68 Nova to run 130 and we did that, it IS harder than it looks) but I didn't like what the salt was doing to the Nova so I built the Stude, with the 150 club in mind, but with a rule book (several) in hand, and built the car to more or less comp specs. Believe me, it is easier to 'overbuild' in the beginning than to 'upgrade' later! We did the 150 and have since moved to A/cgalt, (BBC 496ci.) and we are having a blast! The LSR people are some of the nicest in the world, so much so, that we have closed up our drag racing operation to concentrate on Bonneville. I don't go with the idea to set a record, just having a ball going as fast as I WANT to or at least as fast as the CAR wants to. So my advise would be build a car within your means, run the 150 to get you feet wet and then have at it full bore, but build the car initially with that in mind, it is a fairly easy transition.But do SOMETHING, 'cause as we are seeing first hand, not sure how long we have to enjoy this super form of racing! Enjoy>  Ed

[sdroadster]

I agree with the responders that said try to go fast, and have fun. I built a 54 Studebaker #352 knowing I would probably never see a record. I had a boyhood dream of chopping the top on a Studebaker. Unfortunately cutting the top puts the car in Comp Coupe which is a very fast class. The good thing about the class is that you have the freedom to experiment with a lot of things, including aerodynamics and be well within the rules. My car is built on a Chevy S10 chassis. Years ago I saw a father and son team running the crap out of a lien sale S10 with a SBC in it. The man said it handled well, and they ran it all week long at Bonneville. I remembered that when my Studebaker build started. I discovered that a extended cab S10 has a wheel base about two inches longer than a Stude frame, and shares a lot of similarities in terms of ladder frame design. My car has a junk yard 9" Ford big bearing rear end, new Moser axles, and a Muncie 4 speed trans. 2010 was the first time at Bonneville and I went 210mph with a street rod hand me down 383 SBC on nitrous. Since then the fastest I have been is 221 at Bonneville, and 186 at El Mirage with a 359 cu in SBC that is a retired wet sump circle track motor. My advice is to repeat to yourself  KEEP IT SIMPLE. Unless your looking for the last MPH you don't need the expensive technology. Anybody can work on Holley carbs, and a MSD ignition. Build a good strong quality car, and  KEEP IT SIMPLE.  Good luck!  

[Flipper_1938]

I agree with the responders that said try to go fast, and have fun. I built a 54 Studebaker #352 knowing I would probably never see a record. I had a boyhood dream of chopping the top on a Studebaker. Unfortunately cutting the top puts the car in Comp Coupe which is a very fast class. The good thing about the class is that you have the freedom to experiment with a lot of things, including aerodynamics and be well within the rules. My car is built on a Chevy S10 chassis. Years ago I saw a father and son team running the crap out of a lien sale S10 with a SBC in it. The man said it handled well, and they ran it all week long at Bonneville. I remembered that when my Studebaker build started. I discovered that a extended cab S10 has a wheel base about two inches longer than a Stude frame, and shares a lot of similarities in terms of ladder frame design. My car has a junk yard 9" Ford big bearing rear end, new Moser axles, and a Muncie 4 speed trans. 2010 was the first time at Bonneville and I went 210mph with a street rod hand me down 383 SBC on nitrous. Since then the fastest I have been is 221 at Bonneville, and 186 at El Mirage with a 359 cu in SBC that is a retired wet sump circle track motor. My advice is to repeat to yourself  KEEP IT SIMPLE. Unless your looking for the last MPH you don't need the expensive technology. Anybody can work on Holley carbs, and a MSD ignition. Build a good strong quality car, and  KEEP IT SIMPLE.  Good luck!  

Wow that's pretty fast for not being "serious".  Do you have construction pictures posted anywhere?  I would love to see pics of the S-10 under a Stude.

[sdroadster]

I have tried to figure out how to post pictures. I'll ask my wife to help in a minute.
This was my first attempt at building a race car. I have built a lot of street rods, but became board with them. Like most things hand made, there were some design improvements along the way. The big things I remember were fuel line size (increased to 1/2 inch) and a bypass fuel regulator. I added lead ballast on plates that run from about the middle of the door to just in front of the rear end. I had a real low air dam under the front bumper, but I discovered if shortened it up I gained speed with no handling Ill effects. I first ran the car on the salt in 2010, now six years later I thought it was time to address some corrosion issues, and fix some little things. Currently the body is off the frame, so I can send you a picture of the S10 frame bare. I never thought I would be a contender for a record, but I have been very satisfied with the cars performance and handling characteristics. The S10 chassis has been modified. It was mostly the removal of stock cross members, and replacing them with square tubing. Also, during the build I was concerned about getting the car low enough so I Zeed the frame 2 inches front and rear. The good thing about S10 chassis are they share a lot of similar parts with other GM chassis so circle track related springs, shocks, steering, etc. will all fit. Speedway Engineering has tons of suspension parts that fit the application. Little pickup truck chassis have about 2 degrees of caster in the front end. But, if you swap the upper control arms right to left, and left to right the caster goes to 14 degrees. I shimmed mine back to 12 degrees, and left it alone.

[sdroadster]

Here's a picture during the initial build.

[Flipper_1938]

I have tried to figure out how to post pictures. I'll ask my wife to help in a minute.
This was my first attempt at building a race car. I have built a lot of street rods, but became board with them. Like most things hand made, there were some design improvements along the way. The big things I remember were fuel line size (increased to 1/2 inch) and a bypass fuel regulator. I added lead ballast on plates that run from about the middle of the door to just in front of the rear end. I had a real low air dam under the front bumper, but I discovered if shortened it up I gained speed with no handling Ill effects. I first ran the car on the salt in 2010, now six years later I thought it was time to address some corrosion issues, and fix some little things. Currently the body is off the frame, so I can send you a picture of the S10 frame bare. I never thought I would be a contender for a record, but I have been very satisfied with the cars performance and handling characteristics. The S10 chassis has been modified. It was mostly the removal of stock cross members, and replacing them with square tubing. Also, during the build I was concerned about getting the car low enough so I Zeed the frame 2 inches front and rear. The good thing about S10 chassis are they share a lot of similar parts with other GM chassis so circle track related springs, shocks, steering, etc. will all fit. Speedway Engineering has tons of suspension parts that fit the application. Little pickup truck chassis have about 2 degrees of caster in the front end. But, if you swap the upper control arms right to left, and left to right the caster goes to 14 degrees. I shimmed mine back to 12 degrees, and left it alone.

I would love to see more pics of the chassis.  After you Z'd the frame front and rear, did you lower the suspension more (dropped spindles, springs , etc...)?  or is it still stock-ish (other than swapping control arms)?  S-10's are pretty narrow, how well do the front wheels sit in the front opening?

[sdroadster]

I used everything available to lower the chassis. Bell dropped spindles, shorter front coil springs, and de-arched rear leaf springs. The S10 frame is pretty wide (thick). I got the frame really low, but the body sits on top of the frame and gives the appearance of the car not sitting as low as others. I'm 6'4" 240, so I don't fit in smallish cars well. But if I could, I might consider channeling the car several inches to get the body to sit right. The SCTA rules say the driver must sit on top of the frame, so I had to forget about getting the car lower. With the chopped top, I am at the point of getting squished inside.  Chevy made a high performance S10 called an Extreme that had really heavy sway bars front and rear. I found some on Ebay and bolted them on. The car has about an inch of ride in the front, and almost none in the back. I have reason to believe the car goes down on the snubbers at speed. I was in the 4th mile a Bonneville in 2012, going about 190 and I realized I was driving one handed, as I had forgot to take the other hand off the shifter. That is how good it runs if the salt is in good shape. Last year the salt was rough as hell, and car was a handful to drive. 

[aircap]

With the chopped top, I am at the point of getting squished inside.

Will the rules allow you to lean the seat back a bit?
How about a "Gurney bubble" on the roof?

[SPARKY]

I second that ----we are not driving a road race---Aero is the cheapest performance we can buy

[sdroadster]

I agree with you guys. The problem is I learned that I "should have" after the car and roll cage were built. Maybe someday a new owner can make these changes. For now staying safe, and having family campouts seem to be the priority.

[jimmy six]

floydger....as i remember that beautiful Studie has just been insulted..it had a GMC in it when Joe Fontana and I looked at it..

[floydjer]

I shall apologize to it when I am at Andy`s  shop on Friday....