Author Topic: A question about off-road tires  (Read 2830 times)

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Offline tallguy

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A question about off-road tires
« on: April 19, 2016, 02:17:58 AM »
I have never used off-road tires on any kind of vehicle, and
am wondering how well they would work, compared to typical
street tires.

More specifically, on a Toyota truck, on damp -- or even muddy --
ground, how much more grip is available if I change to off-road
tires, the same size as my original tires?

I realize I am probably over-simplifying, and I apologize.  I also realize
that there are forums for off-road activities.  But I'm more familiar
with this forum, and I even know some of you racers as friends.

Thanks in advance for any answers or guidance.

Offline Speed Limit 1000

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Re: A question about off-road tires
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2016, 03:10:36 AM »
Look on tirerack.com. You can find specs and reviews for most tires.
John Gowetski, red hat @ 221.183 MPH MSA Lakester, Bockscar #1000 60 ci normally aspirated w/N20

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: A question about off-road tires
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2016, 01:18:53 AM »
Once I put off-road tires on my Toyota truck.  They were noisy and it seemed to take a lot more concentration to keep the truck going straight at highway speeds.  This was a problem 'cause most of my driving was on-road.  This is what I learned.

First, tire performance is subjective.  Some folks love some tires that others cannot stand and this really applies to noise.  It pays to go to a dealer and to test drive a new vehicle with the tires or to borrow a friend's truck with them on it.

Second, often you get what you pay for a lot of the time.  Several people told me the el-cheapo tires I bought had problems the better quality ones did not.     

   

Offline JamesJ

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Re: A question about off-road tires
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2016, 04:51:28 PM »
If you are just wanting some more grip during wet weather when drin you may want to just see about lowering your air pressure.  Keep in mind you will need to fill them back up after. 

Offline tallguy

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Re: A question about off-road tires
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2016, 08:30:46 PM »
Thank you all for your responses.  I think I should be more specific,
so here goes:

I have a 2007 Toyota Tacoma, with NO optional anything.  It's 2WD,
automatic transmission, and not very powerful.  It has the smallest
engine, rated at something like 159 HP, but generally feels like less.
I think this may be because it has an automatic transmission.

I plan to do some driving up a dirt hill in about a month.  It's not very
steep.  I estimate the slope to not be more than about ten degrees
from horizontal.  And there is not much growing there.  I think it's
mostly bare dirt, with a few occasional smallish rocks.  Unfortunately,
I don't know whether the ground is sandy, claylike, or what.  It's not
in a valley, so I don't think it has a lot of sand.  And I won't know until
I arrive how wet or damp it will be.  The elevation is about 6,000 ft, and
this is in the Rocky Mountains. 

Furthermore, I don't have much money.  I recently bought a set of new
street tires (the original size -- 215/70 R15), and am concerned only with
spinning my tires while driving up this hill.  I will be going very slowly, with
no load in the truck.  Just me.  So I would (tentatively) like to buy just 2
off-road tires and put them on the rear wheels.  I have no idea how much
traction is available.  I don't know whether it is 30% more, 50% more, or
100% more, or even more than that  (all compared with street tires).  So
I am looking for any suggestions based on real-life experience you have.

My concern is not with noise or durability of the tires.  And I can certainly
be extra-careful while driving on pavement (I expect that the overall
handling of the vehicle would suffer on the street).  I just don't want to
get stuck in the mud, several miles away from the paved road I used to
get to this hill.

I already plan to open the tailgate, in order to transfer a little weight onto
the rear tires.  And I'm also thinking about using about 5 psi less air pressure
than I would if I were driving on a paved street.  Of course, I would certainly
go easy on the throttle.  And choose a route up this hill that has more gentle
slopes, so I can avoid any steep ones.

Any other ideas I should be aware of?  By the way, I don't much know one brand
from another, when it comes to tires.  And I am pretty poor.  If you could share
your actual experience, I'd appreciate it.  Looking at a comparison chart that uses
terms like "long tread life" or "best value" doesn't seem very helpful to me. 

Now if someone said that I should definitely choose "mud tires", that would be
more meaningful.  I have no idea how much a slightly "coarser" tread actually
grabs the ground, compared to a typical tread on a "street" tire.

Thank you in advance for your input.

Andrew Lampenfeld

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: A question about off-road tires
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2016, 11:58:16 PM »
My truck is a 2008 four cylinder 2WD with no options and I am sorta low budget, too.  Racing has something to do with that.  It climbs really well and is the best 2WD truck I have owned when it goes off-road.  Just in case, I always have a good jack and chains to use if I get stuck, which has never happened.   

Offline tallguy

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Re: A question about off-road tires
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2016, 02:59:15 AM »
Have you ever spun your tires while off-road?  What kind of tires do you have?

I guess what I'm really trying to learn would be a comparison of dirt tires'
traction, compared to street tires.  If someone told me that the dirt tires
grip (say) 60% better than street tires, that would be meaningful to me.

The good news is that going uphill, weight transfers to the rear tires.
When going downhill, I won't be applying as much power, so the tires
shouldn't spin.  Now, sinking into mud is a whole 'nother issue!  For that
reason alone, I may want to (just in case the ground has had a lot of
recent rain, just before I arrive) go oversize on the tires, while still taking
care that they're not so big that they drag or bump any part of my truck.

I'm starting to think that maybe I should go looking for some dirt near where
I live, and do some experimentation, to test how well my street tires work.
I do have a few weeks in which to do this, and perhaps with some occasional
rainy days, I can sample various amounts of "muddiness" in the same place.
Perhaps not too "statistically" significant, but should at least give me a real
"feel" for what's going on.  I would be careful to choose a place that is easy
to get "unstuck" from.  Example:  If I'm going uphill and spin the tires, I should
be able to just shift into reverse, and back out of that spot if I haven't "dug
in" too deep, right?  I would bring some pieces of wood to stick under the tires,
just in case I do get a little stuck.  I don't have a winch, and the place may
not have any nearby trees anyway.  This is all just tentative thinking.

Comments?  Suggestions?   Thanks.

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: A question about off-road tires
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2016, 09:44:07 PM »
After the off-road tire experiment I went back to using light truck tires in the standard P215/70 R 15 size.  Firestone P215's or Destination LE.  The truck was often used as the mule for carrying tools, lunch, and all sorts of things for our local dirt bike club when we did trail maintenance.  The rough terrain combined with my complete lack of common sense got me onto all sorts of bad roads.  The street tires seemed to be as good as the off-road ones unless it was muddy.  That was when the aggressive tread patterns helped.

The big problem with radials has been puncturing the sidewalls with sharp rocks.  That makes me go slower on rocked roads than I did with bias ply tires.  There was some model and brand of tire that resisted this damage.  My father used them.  The tire dealer might know.