What does the future hold?

[Gary Perkinson]

I have always wondered how much it would cost to build a 10 mile stretch of concrete track say 14 feet wide? Anybody in the road building business.

I just pulled these numbers from a 2012 study of highway costs in Arkansas (I only used it because it was the first comprehensive highway-cost study to pop up). Assuming that it would probably be necessary for safety reasons to have, say, at least a 40-foot-wide track, you might look at a four-lane highway with a painted median (with each lane about 11 feet wide) for your model. In Arkansas, building this kind of highway in a rural setting would cost approximately $4,725,000 per mile (I'm not sure if that includes the land or not, but I'm assuming not). Now, a remote desert track might be cheaper than that, but using those numbers, a 10-mile, 44-foot wide track would cost about $50 million, PLUS (I would assume) another $25 million (or maybe less, who knows) for a parallel return road. Then, of course, you would have the extra costs of building parking and pit areas, staging and shutdown areas, and possibly access roads, which would probably take the whole thing up to $100 million. 

Believe me, I've often thought how awesome it would be for someone or some entity to build such a facility, but the above costs seem depressingly realistic to me (and no, I don't work in the road-building business)...

Gary

[nrhs sales]

25 ft...?...Harley's must be more stable and have better drivers than anyone else

WTF is with that smatazz response?

..at the Colorado mile we were using no more than a 20 foot wide track and both cars and bikes were going well in excess of 200 mph.  Not sure why you would think you would need more than a  25 foot wide track Joe?

At NHRA drag races they race cars to 300 mph side by side with only a 60 foot wide track.

[joea]

Uh..how long was the timing trap ...?..and how many streamliners and vehicles with relative aero bodies ...do you feel would be safe in a 25 or so ft lane ...nearing terminal vel (ie 300-400-500 mph )with occasional wind effects maintaining top velocity for minimum of 1000m or 5280 ft

[nrhs sales]

I am sure there are a lot of folks who would be willing to run on a 25 foot wide track if it was available.   Folks run over 200 mph on the autobahn and are able to keep their cars in their 12 foot wide lane with no issues.

 If your bike is not stable enough for you to feel confident on a 25 foot lane then maybe you should reconsider your aero package.  Sounds like you are justifying why BMST does not allow bodywork such as yours to participate at their event as you are acknowledging it is not safe.

And where did I say anything about cars or bikes for that matter running 300 mph or more in my initial post?  I just asked how much it would cost to build something. Please do not put words in my mouth as I never said anything at all about how fast the vehicles would be did I?  

That is the problem with the internet.  Everyone wants to act like they are so smart, so to prove their point they use "facts" that have nothing to do with the post.

[joea]

Uh...seriously trying to similar my ask questions...and tried to keep it light ...I understand folks are edgy these days

folks are asking questions about paving some LSR sustainable venue..all I did was ask questions and answer yours ...

loring exists for many

My body is legal for BMST , and I hope to run there some day...

Yu know to enjoy each other's company face to face instead of this internet banter etc

[nrhs sales]

You are probably right. Just seemed like you were trying to start an argument with me for no reason.

Cheers

[jl222]

 
  I hope someone  is considering a berm to restore a race course.

  For instance 1/4 mile wide 1320 ft by 11 miles 58,080 ft = 76,665, 000 sq ft or 8,518,333 sq yds.

  Salt weighs 75 lbs per cu ft, at 27 cu ft per cu yd =2075 lbs per cu yd Just over a ton.

  So how much salt needs to be pumped for the above course 2 or 3'' thick?

               JL222

[BurtonBrown]

To all

The meeting yesterday at lands end of was actually at 9am and Rick Vesco and Roger Lessman did a real good job organizing it and getting the right people there. There were reps from Intrepid, BLM, DNR, Utah Goveners office, Save the Salt, Press, university geologist, Racers and some spectators.
I personally flew out from Wisconsin just for this meeting. It lasted until about noon that was followed by a closed door meeting in Wendover.
I can only tell you that this is a good start as it seems there are quite a few concerned about this now including the Gov.s office. There are 6-7 different proposals we understood that were being discussed at the closed door meeting and I assume they will be shared here shortly.
We obviously have to work together at this so everyone keep a positive attitude and things will start to happen.
Sid and I have lots of pics videos we will be sharing.
Burton Brown

[Seldom Seen Slim]

Glen Barrett forwarded this to me from Jinx Vesco:



Rick's meeting with state officials, legislators, potash miners, BLM, engineers, press went very well. He had the geologist lady digging in the salt to see the mud layer. There will be a joint press release coming out soon. Rick stayed up there because it is raining a little. He is going to go out on the flats tomorrow to see how wet they are.
That's it for now!
Jinx


Thanks, Glen

[Gary Perkinson]

So how much salt needs to be pumped for the above course 2 or 3'' thick?

I could be wrong, but I don't think the amount of pumping is as much of a problem as WHAT they're pumping. The brine that Intrepid sends back has been leached of its potassium, so it won't set up like the salt has done naturally for centuries. I don't know if a dry-salt laydown is the answer or even possible, but whatever the case, I don't think what Intrepid is doing is helping much...

[joea]

""There were reps from Intrepid, BLM, DNR, Utah Goveners office, Save the Salt, Press, university geologist, Racers and some spectators.""

Did this also include any Govt officials or business owners from Wendover, ie any of the Mayors, and or
Casino mngmt. ?

[kiwi belly tank]

As you can see by the list there were Govt officials including the Utah Goveners Deputy who made a very positive statement on camera stating they are keen to see Bonneville returned to a functioning race venue & not end up with a future sign stating "this is where Land Speed Records were once set". This footage will be seen on Utah Channel 4, I will stay in contact with them & post a link when it goes to air.
Mike Crawford was not there but sent a stand in.
  Sid.

[Sumner]

So how much salt needs to be pumped for the above course 2 or 3'' thick?

I could be wrong, but I don't think the amount of pumping is as much of a problem as WHAT they're pumping. The brine that Intrepid sends back has been leached of its potassium, so it won't set up like the salt has done naturally for centuries. I don't know if a dry-salt laydown is the answer or even possible, but whatever the case, I don't think what Intrepid is doing is helping much...

From a non-scientific view, but just observing, the salt was much better after pumping started vs. the years leading up to it in the late 1990's in my opinion.  The composition without the potassium still yielded hard salt to race on for many years.  The way things were looking in the late 90's led to me deciding to 'not' build a car but when things then did improve I changed my mind and started on one.  

Without the lay-down effort that went on we would of found the salt to of gotten worst much sooner than it has.  It is still hard to say what would of happened this year as far as racing if we wouldn't of had the mud flow out onto the salt.  Regardless of the mud situation the salt needs to be replenished at a faster rate than what the lay-down accomplished in the past.

I think at this point we don't have a choice as to what salt can be laid back down as the only salt that is remotely financially available is the salt south of the highway,

Sumner

[jl222]

  I hope someone  is considering a berm to restore a race course.

  For instance 1/4 mile wide 1320 ft by 11 miles 58,080 ft = 76,665, 000 sq ft or 8,518,333 sq yds.

  Salt weighs 75 lbs per cu ft, at 27 cu ft per cu yd =2075 lbs per cu yd Just over a ton.

  So how much salt needs to be pumped for the above course 2 or 3'' thick?

               JL222

  OK, looks like I have to try this. 1 cu yd 36in high divided into 2'' sections is 18 x 9 sq ft [ 3' x3' ] per section = 162 sq ft
per cu yd.

  76,665,000 divided by 162=473,240 cu yds . 1 cu yd of salt is just over 1 ton. So 473,240 tons of salt is needed for a 2'' deep course as above.

  Is 473,240 tons 95.6% less or 4.4% of 10,700,000 ?

  Whew!!   JL222

[Avanti Kid]

Hey, has anyone thought about the possible land speed racing at White Sands, in New Mexico? what kind of traction would that be, would the US Government let us apply for a 8 mile course there?? just a thought, take care, Dave