Author Topic: What do you think about cost control?  (Read 35687 times)

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Offline kustombrad

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #15 on: December 27, 2014, 11:29:50 AM »
If it did happen, how COULD you police it? This is racing and the guys who push it to the edge will ALWAYS be faster than everyone else. Those "spec" motors are supposed to be "even" but how even are they? Is there a 5-10 HP difference from one to another? If I got the tools from the Snap On truck to remove the "weird bolts" from the engine in order to make mine MORE fair (squaring the deck, degreeing the cam, blueprinting every inch of the motor) does that make me or the motor a cheater if it's still technically the same? I'm building my car because I want it to be the fastest in it's class in the WORLD, not just with 4 or 5 guys. I don't see how spec racing could ever work in this group...

Offline Stan Back

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #16 on: December 27, 2014, 11:52:17 AM »
"I like the idea allowing the C/AIR motor specs in other car classes similar to the vintage “X” engines." . . . and spec blowers, too?

Got to include all the displacement levels, too.  Fuel and Gas.  Got to be fair.  That would, in essence, triple the now enuf car classes. 

Years ago the sage J.D. Tone suggested the relief to the "problems" that started this thread.  You're running vehicle #3345?  Every time you run faster than before, you get a record (for vehicle #3345).  Congratulations!  For an extra $299.95 (plus s&h), we'll send you your trophy.
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Offline RichFox

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #17 on: December 27, 2014, 12:12:19 PM »
If I was writing rules for a C/AIR kind of class and wanted to promote guys running Lincoln, Packard and Olds motors, I would have included "Single rocker shaft engines only". Keep out the 350 Chevys and Hemi Chryslers. Then I would make an exception for Pontiacs and 348 Chevys. Chevys and Chryslers don't need a protected class. Or just not have the class. The idea of crate motors and rev limiters at Bonneville, would never have occurred  to  me except for this thread.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2014, 12:15:42 PM by RichFox »

Offline SPARKY

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #18 on: December 27, 2014, 12:42:35 PM »
  We just got old and broke and now pick our fights.

Lots of ways to play the game -- just choose the one that fits.  Please don't try to alter the playing board or the rules.

Stan Back

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Stan,   I am with you and while we are at it  :dhorse:  KILL AIR TOO--  :dhorse: --- happened just like we  figured

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Offline Vinsky

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #19 on: December 27, 2014, 02:03:10 PM »
Remember the 'claim rule' in other forms of racing? Say the rules allow any engine in a particular class can not be worth more than a thousand bucks. You set a record, or win a race, a competitor can step up and buy your engine for a thousand bucks. Keeps the price down and expands knowlege.
John

Offline Speed Limit 1000

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #20 on: December 27, 2014, 02:24:37 PM »
Hell Stainless has lots of recording holding motors he would sell for $1000 each. Their fastest run is almost always their last :cheers:
John Gowetski, red hat @ 221.183 MPH MSA Lakester, Bockscar #1000 60 ci normally aspirated w/N20

Offline Peter Jack

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #21 on: December 27, 2014, 02:29:32 PM »
My experience with claim rules is with IMCA modifieds. The rule only somewhat works. Those who want to will spend what it takes to win and consider the claim as a part of doing business. There's a fair bit more spent on most competitive claimer class engines than the price of the claim. Claimer rules don't really work.

Pete

Offline BHR301

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #22 on: December 27, 2014, 02:31:54 PM »
My personal suggestion for rule changes in the SCTA....If It Ain't Broke, Don't Fix It!   :cheers:

Bill

Offline 55chevr

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #23 on: December 27, 2014, 03:07:43 PM »
The IMCA deal is same size engines ... as in 355 cu in SBC.   That covers  just "C" engine class.   Would need a spec engine for each engine class. Plus fuel / supercharged. 

Offline Dynoroom

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #24 on: December 27, 2014, 03:15:06 PM »
Soooo, how would you police the engines in a spec class? Seals, Claims, tear down? Who or how would this be done?
Michael LeFevers
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Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #25 on: December 27, 2014, 04:14:19 PM »
One last thought on this from me - and as my wife points out, sometimes I'm open minded to a fault.

I've gotten involved up to my eyelids in this sport, so maybe - maybe - I'm not seeing a clear path that an outsider might see.

But let's test this theory.

Might there be interest in this idea if it were set up as a stand-alone event, independent of SCTA-BNI or USFRA?

On these forums, I'll acknowledge the fact that most of us are invested in the status quo.

And as a follower of these boards, I've seen countless build diaries start off with the best intentions, but the cars never materialize.

It's fair to assume that one of the reasons is that they ran out of money.

This spec engine idea is so contrary to what currently happens, that I could see it having an appeal to folks who simply want to get some salt in their diet, but are stymied by the cost of an engine.

With between 500 and 600 entries at Speedweek, I don't know that putting more cars up at the event is the best idea.

But if this spec engine idea was strong enough to stand on its own, it might - again, might -

A. Relieve some pressure on Speedweek by siphoning off a few competitors who are there simply to drive fast on the salt, AND
B. Expose those who might want to move on to the next step with a taste of what this really involves.

I doubt there is room in the current structure for what's being proposed here, but if an independent sanctioning body were willing to step up to the plate, it might succeed - I just don't see it working in the sanctioning structure that already exists.
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

Offline RichFox

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #26 on: December 27, 2014, 04:27:38 PM »
That's why USFRA has the 130 and 150 clubs. If the poster want's a 300 club of sorts, it's up to him to do it. Most of the people here have been doing it the hard way for 20 or 30 years or more. For me cost control depends on what I am willing to spend. No reason for not running a Speedway crate motor with a rev limiter. Or a Packard motor for that matter. But don't expect a record. Just be happy for the experience.

Offline Stainless1

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #27 on: December 27, 2014, 04:54:01 PM »
Yep, you want to run a crate motor put it in a street legal car and try the 130 club.... then add a roll bar and go for 150. 
Cost control at its finest.  :cheers:

The sport is landspeed racing, not limited landspeed racing.
BTW which of my doorstops would like to claim for $1000  :-D
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, Bockscar Lakester #1000 with a little N2O

Offline Seldom Seen Slim

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #28 on: December 27, 2014, 06:00:18 PM »
The ultimate in cost control is about where the SSS team is right now:  Run out of money and you're done.

See??  It's very simple. :-D :-D
Jon E. Wennerberg
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Offline krusty

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Re: What do you think about cost control?
« Reply #29 on: December 27, 2014, 06:18:05 PM »
Hopefully the SCTA NEVER follows the really bad lead of the France family and tries to make it a "fair" deal and passes out "participation" hats!

I'd wager that a number of participants in this thread have a SCTA/BNI  t-shirt that says "Participant"; it's a component of an entrant's package. And there are hats, too.  Be careful what you wish for... :evil: :-D

vic