Author Topic: Stream liner length  (Read 9227 times)

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Offline debgeo

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Stream liner length
« on: July 31, 2014, 01:13:15 AM »
I see a big difference in length of streamliners. Is length determined by area needed or does longer length help aerodynamicly ?
George---Sidecar in progress

Offline John Noonan

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2014, 01:45:52 AM »
Sorta and yes..ymmv

Offline SPARKY

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2014, 09:53:00 AM »
John has just about said it----Packaging is everything---if you try to use "normal" stuff you will end up being pretty big if you are trying to use big HP---downsizing COSTS
Miss LIBERTY,  changing T.K.I.  to noise, dust, rust, BLUE HATS & hopefully not scrap!!

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller

We are going to explore the racing N words NITROUS & NITRO!

Offline kiwi belly tank

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2014, 10:51:41 AM »
My liner builds have always been about packaging. To get a small frontal area & fit all the crap in, they tend to get long. My new liner came out at 40ft & that created some transporting issues.
  Sid.

Offline tauruck

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2014, 12:42:46 AM »
My liner builds have always been about packaging. To get a small frontal area & fit all the crap in, they tend to get long. My new liner came out at 40ft & that created some transporting issues.
  Sid.

You think??????
Sid helped me when I started out. I still know squat but he was right on the money.
Packaging is a little understated. :-D

Offline SPARKY

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2014, 11:00:17 AM »
lol

"Packaging is a little understated.  grin"

I encourage you to build something that can be changed fairly easily--

You most likely will be changing things---I have run my new car twice.

We are in the thrash of an axle change and axle mounting change modifying the canopy-- lots of wiring change and rerouting, hood scoop modifications.  Once we find out what "Ms. Liberty" likes and dislikes we will then really try to build a nice final version ---with PAINT!!

We rebuilt RATICAL, nearly completely 3 times, before we got a  car that could handle the HP and the race course---hopefully it will not take 3 rebuilds this time around!

I say this, because (IMO) if you build a really nicely finished car you are a lot less likely to start cutting and chopping to make changes, you may need to, or try new ideas.

My thoughts are get a GOOD race car---FIRST--- then try to spiff it!

As they say YMMV   :cheers:

« Last Edit: August 01, 2014, 12:57:38 PM by SPARKY »
Miss LIBERTY,  changing T.K.I.  to noise, dust, rust, BLUE HATS & hopefully not scrap!!

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller

We are going to explore the racing N words NITROUS & NITRO!

Offline dw230

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2014, 11:17:47 AM »
When building any car you must keep maintenance in mind. If you have a tightly packaged design, tanks laying on top of each other for instance, plan on which ones can be removed easily and more often. Is the engine set back? How do you get a head off without unbolting the engine. Do you have a fully belly panned car? How to easily do bottom end maintenance without complete disassembly?

It goes on and on ...

DW
White Goose Bar - Where LSR is a lifestyle
Alcohol - because no good story starts with a salad.

Don't be Karen, be Beth

Offline John Burk

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2014, 01:16:16 PM »
Ron Ayers said above 300 mph over 70% of the aero drag of a streamliner is skin friction . That says minimizing the surface area is worth more that minimizing the frontal area . A 3' x 3' x 10' box has the same volume as a 2' x 2' x 22.5' box and the 10' one has 2/3 the surface area .

Offline kustombrad

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2014, 11:16:59 PM »
But at 300mph do you want to be in a 10 ft. long box or a 22.5 ft. one?

Offline kiwi belly tank

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2014, 01:20:34 AM »
I too am having a problem seeing how a short fat liner could out perform a skinny one. Anybody have any pics of a "short" Ron Ayres design? :roll:
  Sid.

Offline John Burk

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2014, 01:54:22 AM »
The wheelbase of the Black Salt Triumph is 130 inches .

Offline kustombrad

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #11 on: August 06, 2014, 10:06:32 AM »
That Triumph isn't really a streamliner but we'll do a quick comparison anyway. It went 380mph with roughly 2000hp and it's pretty short and fat. Speed Demon is roughly 35ft long (obviously more surface area) and with the D motor (a little less than 2000hp) it went 420mph. Not really apples to apples but part of that theory doesn't really fly (even if it's technically correct) or streamliners would still look like they did in the 60's.

Offline tauruck

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #12 on: August 06, 2014, 10:11:53 AM »
Brad, you built it long and you know why. :-D

Offline John Burk

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #13 on: August 06, 2014, 02:14:17 PM »
I agree , with it's high drag , high frontal area and 50/50 static weight distribution Black Salt is a poor comparison but the difference wasn't handling . It would sound silly if somebody proposed a 130" wheel base top fuel dragster but that's what funny cars have .

Offline kustombrad

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Re: Stream liner length
« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2014, 03:10:12 PM »
That's actually a cool thing to bring up John! Since a Funny Car is all about aero since it's short wheelbase doesn't allow as much clutch as a TF (the longer wheelbase transfers better) car. Kinda makes you wonder (if you detuned it to actually hold up) and ran them both to 1/2 or 3/4 of a mile if the FC would actually have an aero advantage and make it have a higher MPH being both shorter and wider?! Sorry to get completely off track there...