Author Topic: Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class  (Read 5910 times)

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Offline flak monkey

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Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class
« on: March 15, 2014, 05:21:30 PM »
Seen several threads on this with no specific answer to my question....

We are running a methanol bike at Speed Week this year, it's fitted with an electric fuel pump - inline fuel injection type. I've read elsewhere that an electric kill switch on the bars will meet the rules for positive fuel shut off.

Only question is, most electric pumps don't actually prevent fuel flowing by gravity when they are turned off, so do they really meet the rules or do we need to fit a valve (solenoid or mechanical) in the feed before the pump as well?

Offline Stan Back

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Re: Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2014, 08:04:15 PM »
Don't you think that would be the safe thing to do, rules or not?
Past (Only) Member of the San Berdoo Roadsters -- "California's Most-Exclusive Roadster Club" -- 19 Years of Bonneville and/or El Mirage Street Roadster Records

Offline flak monkey

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Re: Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2014, 01:30:09 PM »
Well, we will have a fuel tap anyway, but it won't be possible to activate it from the bars without some additional modifications.

The fuel pump power feed will be shut off from the bars.

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2014, 12:47:12 AM »
Pingel makes a guzzler fuel cock with enough flow capacity and it can be turned off by a lever on the bars.  I had mine rigged up with a tether so it would be shut off if I fell from the bike.  That was sort of mickey mouse.  The final setup was to put a tip-over valve in the fuel line instead of the tether.  This way, the fuel can be shut off by me from the bar lever or, if I fall off, by the tip over valve.  I can send pictures if you want.   

Offline JimL

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Re: Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2014, 12:32:45 AM »
Be very careful with this.  If you cut the fuel, but the pump continues running without fuel flow, it wipes out the bearings and brushes.  This type pump may not gravity feed.  Gravity bench check your pump, to confirm what you have....read my 3rd paragraph if your pump has free flow.

If you dont think this can be ugly, check out the number of people looking for "good" replacement pumps for their EFI bikes that they goofed, and "ran out of gas"....never to run again.  I really, really, dont like to see an EFI pump run out of fuel....that is the lubricant for the armature bearings and brushes as the gasoline flows through them.

You may wish to be certain that the fuel pump power shuts down before that mechanical valve chokes off fuel supply.  I plan to run a secondary "fuse blow" kill function off of my Pingle Guzzler valve, to be sure that I keep that expensive pump alive.  This will short circuit the "relay control coil side" power and blow the fuse for that portion of the circuit, as the Pingle rotates.  Fuses are cheap, and if I am smart enough to remember to turn off the fuel pump relay circuit, before pulling the Pingle lever, I wont need many fuses.


If you are not confident about your pump circuit kill arrangement (as when connecting to a manual shut off), you may be wise to avoid a mechanical shut off.  Your grounding type tether switch, wired to the fuel pump relay control side power (after its fuse) will blow the instant the tether is yanked and the pump will absolutely stop.  The rules already require your master electric shutoff control on the handlebar.  Adding mechanical cutoff could be an expensive mistake if not taken to that extra step I mentioned.

Apologies for the discombobulated post....kinda hard to explain without waving my hands around in the air.

JimL

Added note...this might be another way.   http://www.12voltfuelvalves.com/79-afc161.html
« Last Edit: March 19, 2014, 12:48:12 AM by JimL »

Offline maj

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Re: Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2014, 07:18:57 AM »
What about a check valve on the pump outlet , no power no flow ..

Offline manta22

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Re: Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class
« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2014, 12:51:06 PM »
JimL;

If those fuel pumps are like the Carter rotary vane fuel pumps, the fuel also cools the motor.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2014, 01:35:25 AM »
Today I was working on my system and I discovered that I had a fuel tank vent tip-over valve installed in the fuel line.  A mistake on my part.  Triumph has a tip-over switch on their fuel injected Bonnevilles that shuts everything off, including the fuel pump, if the bike goes on its side.     

Offline flak monkey

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Re: Motorcycle Positive fuel shut off - fuel class
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2014, 03:20:15 PM »
Thanks for the replys guys. Our pump definately gravity flows, very slowly, but it does.

I had clarification from Matt that what they are looking for is to prevent fuel being pumped from the tank under pressure. If it still gravity flows it's not a problem.

We have a manual mechanical shut off anyway, so we should be covered.