Author Topic: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build  (Read 161751 times)

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Offline Scottie J

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #90 on: December 15, 2013, 09:40:40 AM »
Alright.  So one last thing about the crank, and then time to move on until I need to address it again.  So, everyone knows the "stories" of these Enfield twins having weak bottom ends.  I have been scouring the web for quite some time trying to find every bit of information I can about the 700cc twin motors.  I have to be honest, there isn't hardly ANYTHING out there stating these cranks have a tendency to grenade.  As I mentioned before, the connecting rods were garbage, and it seems like (from what I can find) about 50% of catastrophic failures were caused by throwing a rod, the other other 50% of catastrophic failures were caused by piston seize from over heating the motor by cranking at too high of RPMs for too long with the cast iron cylinders.  I've spent the last hour on Google searching for the likes of "700 twin Royal Enfield Blown Motor".  You know what I found?  A whole bunch of pics of REALLY nice bikes, a few pics of some hot girls on some nice bikes, and a few pics of MY '58 TRAILBLAZER HEADS AND GASKETS when I blew them out in the spring time.  There is basically nothing, and I mean NOTHING out there about these cranks being a POS.  The only information I can find is this:

Quote
After the German surrender in 1945, the Enfield Cycle Company resumed production of the pre-war G and J series civilian models alongside a modified version of the “Flea”. By 1947 the 500cc Model J was back in production, fitted with new hydraulic damping telescopic forks as opposed to the old style girder forks. These were basic “ride-to-work” models which proved popular in a world hungry for inexpensive transport: a large number of surplus military machines were also purchased and reconditioned by the factory. In 1948 a groundbreaking development in the form of rear suspension springing was developed, initially for competition model “trials” models (modern enduro type machines). This was released in 1949 on the first new production models; a 350cc OHV Bullet with a sportier alloy head, swing arm frame and a 500cc twin: Enfield’s 25bhp answer to the Triumph Speed Twin. This machine was the forerunner of a range of Royal Enfield Meteors, Super Meteors and Constellations. Offering good performance at modest cost, these machines sold well at the time despite an unremarkable reputation. The 700cc Royal Enfield Constellation Twin released in 1959 has been described as the first Superbike.

In the late 1950s and early 1960s Royal Enfield produced a number of 250cc machines, the most popular of which was the 248cc pushrod OHV single cylinder Crusader. On the larger displacement end of their line, the first Interceptor was introduced in 1960: a highly tuned version of the company’s 692cc vertical twin intended for export to the USA and Canada. All these engines had the prefix letters “VAX” and are often referred as “VAX Interceptors”. Featuring twin carburetors, a factory lightened and balanced crankshaft, hot “R” cams, Lucas racing magneto and a few other modifications compared to road going models, the highly tuned engines demanded constant maintenance and many ended with catastrophic damages to the bottom end. Only a handful of these bikes survived which makes them one of rarest post-war Royal Enfield models.


Nowhere does it ever say it was the crank itself that failed.  Don't get me wrong, I know this crank isn't invincible, but all my research points towards rod failure, NOT crank failure.

The following information is directly from my Factory Repair Manual:






Here are the rods and pistons I now plan on using available from Hitchcock's:






Scottie

Offline bak189

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #91 on: December 15, 2013, 12:02:37 PM »
Great looking con-rods....I wish we could have had those back in the 1960's when we used the "Cornfield" (Enfield) engine in our road racing sidecars................The stock "Mud rods" would live up to 6500RPM.(maybe)
I have owned and sold a Enfield engine Rickman frame example ......will say it was a very nice street bike.......faster then most Triumph and BSA models of the time..................You might want to check with John Noonan regarding
pistons he represents a outstanding German company that will make you any kind of piston....just give them the specs. and they are through John a realistic price..............I should note that we had some problems with the gear-box road racing....However, for LSR this should not be a problem...........

.
Question authority.....always

Offline Stan Back

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #92 on: December 15, 2013, 01:01:54 PM »
bak189 --

You meant a record over 200, right?
Past (Only) Member of the San Berdoo Roadsters -- "California's Most-Exclusive Roadster Club" -- 19 Years of Bonneville and/or El Mirage Street Roadster Records

Offline desotoman

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #93 on: December 15, 2013, 04:30:29 PM »
What ever happened to that guy from Las Vegas, you know, from years ago, what's his name, that couldn't be deterred?

Stan,

You talking about this guy?  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TywnyPVOx2c

Tom G.
I love the USA. How much longer will we be a free nation?

Asking questions is one's only way of getting answers.

The rational person lets verified facts form or modify his opinion.  The ideologue ignores verified facts which don't fit his preconceived opinions.

Offline Peter Jack

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #94 on: December 15, 2013, 05:43:58 PM »
If he applied the energy he expends on looking for help on working on his own program he'd probably have a record or two by now!  :roll: :roll: :roll:

Pete

Offline salt27

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #95 on: December 15, 2013, 07:02:46 PM »
What ever happened to that guy from Las Vegas, you know, from years ago, what's his name, that couldn't be deterred?

Stan,

You talking about this guy?  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TywnyPVOx2c

Tom G.

That was not pleasant to watch.   :-P

Offline Nortonist 592

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #96 on: December 15, 2013, 07:26:32 PM »
Ouch!  That's a few minutes of my life gone forever.
Get off the stove Grandad.  You're too old to be riding the range.

Offline Stainless1

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #97 on: December 15, 2013, 08:48:36 PM »
lost and gone forever  :x
 :cheers:
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, Bockscar Lakester #1000 with a little N2O

Offline Scottie J

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #98 on: December 15, 2013, 11:33:09 PM »
That dude needs to change his name to Super Klown because he is an a$$ clown for sure!    :-D

And why does he think he's a bad ass?  The only time he can show is 11.57 during a test n tune?  I have friends with pro street cars running that fast.  And he can't even break 10 seconds on a full drag bike?  I think you nailed it Slim with "loser".

Scottie

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #99 on: December 16, 2013, 12:33:33 AM »
Scottie, on the subject of your Enfield crankshaft...

Regardless of the reputation of the crankshaft in general, that rascal is pretty old and it is a good idea to have it checked for cracks by an expert.  The book "The Step-by-Step Guide to Engine Blueprinting" by Rick Vogelin ISBN-13 978-1-884089-26-8 is in print.  It has a section on crankshafts with some good tips.  There is plenty you can do to help your crank to live longer.

A good procedure is to run your engine in a fairly mild NA tune at first and then to tear it down the winter after your first race.  Check it out really good and fix any problems.  Then, up your tune a bit, run it another year, tear it down, and look it over.

Another good practice is to have a machinist measure your journals, etc. before everything is put together.  A good thing is to know what clearances you are running so you will know what is working or not.

A common mistake is to run too tight of clearances between the bearing shells and the journals.  Hitchcocks should be able to give you some advice on this.  My Triumph is set up with clearances halfway between "as new" and the wear limit, as an example.     

Offline Briz

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #100 on: December 16, 2013, 06:42:34 AM »
Scottie; before you order those 'Hitchcocks' rods you might want to contact R&R in Illinois. http://www.rrconnectingrods.com/
Probably save yourself some dough over importing UK parts.
We're using R&R rods in our BSA:


« Last Edit: December 16, 2013, 06:45:07 AM by Briz »

Offline peterdallan

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #101 on: December 16, 2013, 07:29:03 AM »
Using them in our Triumph too.

Peter

Offline Koncretekid

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #102 on: December 16, 2013, 07:52:07 AM »
Scottie,
Lots of engine calculators on the net.  This one suggests maximum RPM.  It basically just divides 24,000 (or 30000 for highest performance parts) by your stroke length in inches to get piston speed.  It suggests that with a nodular iron crank, high performance rods and forged pistons, you should limit your pistons speeds to 4000 fpm.  With your stroke of 90mm, it suggests a maximum RPM of 6800.  If you can get a forged crankshaft and upgrade everything to about NASCAR quality, you might get to 8500 RPM.  I have a 90mm stroke in my road race BSA (and I will be running a similar crank in my 2014 LSR bike) and I safely run it at 7200.  However, I have a steel 5 piece crankshaft, which is probably stronger than a nodular iron one, and I have 3 main bearings on a single cylinder motor.  I did blow one of these up at around 8000 - - expensive pile of scrap metal.
http://thefirstgensite.com/code/maxrpm.htm
Tom
« Last Edit: December 16, 2013, 08:19:56 AM by Koncretekid »
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Offline Scottie J

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #103 on: December 16, 2013, 12:06:51 PM »
Excellent!  Thanks for the tips and advice!  I'll give R&R a call here in the near future and see what they have to say.

Scottie

Offline Stainless1

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #104 on: December 16, 2013, 04:59:27 PM »
Bak also mentioned John Noonan at Wossner America, he is a landspeed scooter racer and not to bad of a guy to talk to about the technical aspects of bike motors.  He can get custom pistons and rods made and at fairly reasonable prices for the landspeed community.  He is a member here, you might send him a note.
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, Bockscar Lakester #1000 with a little N2O