Author Topic: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build  (Read 161828 times)

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Offline SPARKY

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #135 on: January 05, 2014, 09:12:34 AM »
Wow Patrick----I hope you can see your way clear to post more from time to time---this is so humbling---I will try not to complain about being out of room on my Ms Liberty any more   :cheers:
Miss LIBERTY,  changing T.K.I.  to noise, dust, rust, BLUE HATS & hopefully not scrap!!

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller

We are going to explore the racing N words NITROUS & NITRO!

Offline Sumner

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #136 on: January 05, 2014, 10:33:43 AM »
NeatSstuff, pay attention scotty , words can save you lots of money and give you free MPH on a timing slip. best MAD MAX

How true !!  I'd also recommend that he subscribes to Bonneville Racing News and try and pick up back issues or some of the interviews that have gone into book form.  The in-depth article on Stuart Hooper and his 171 mph 650cc Velocette-Based 650cc Single comes to mind as one.

Max I still remember Stainless taking me to your place in the snow and cold some winters back.  I enjoyed that  :-), and hope you are doing well,

Sum

Offline thefrenchowl

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #137 on: January 05, 2014, 10:48:31 AM »
Thanks guys,

I'll start a new thread on improvements to me bike for this year, as to not crowd Scottie's thread...

Patrick
Flat Head Forever

...What exactly are we trying to do here?...

Offline Scottie J

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #138 on: January 06, 2014, 05:53:11 PM »
Wow that's awesome stuff!  I'm definitely going to look into that blower set up.  Looks like you could use a carb or EFI?

Scottie

Offline Nortonist 592

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #139 on: January 06, 2014, 07:37:05 PM »
sssautomotive.com.au can supply you with all the Aisins you could ever dream of.
Get off the stove Grandad.  You're too old to be riding the range.

Offline Scottie J

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #140 on: January 10, 2014, 09:06:40 PM »
So I've been researching those Aisin AMR roots blowers and they are pretty bad ass!  It appears from what I saw that the AMR500 to a 660cc Subaru motor, tho I'm not sure what model.  Does anyone know anything about these guys?  They are offering brand new AMR500s for $500.

http://www.kemotorsport.com/

Scottie

Offline Peter Jack

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #141 on: January 10, 2014, 09:19:05 PM »
For every $AU the price is only $.89US. That makes them even cheaper. It might offset some of the shipping.  :-D :-D :-D

Pete

Offline Scottie J

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #142 on: January 11, 2014, 07:52:07 AM »
For every $AU the price is only $.89US. That makes them even cheaper. It might offset some of the shipping.  :-D :-D :-D

Pete

Freaking A!     :lol:

Need some words of wisdom from guys who have used these blowers or are familiar with them.  My thoughts are to remove the distributor/magneto and have a custom shaft machined that would replace it that can drive the blower.  Is this possible?  A certain individual on the Enfield forum (who is building a RE single for speed trials in England) seems to think that running the blower off of the timing area will cause failure of the timing chain. Also, there is a concern about the speed of the gear there.  The magnetos are listed as being "half speed" of the engine, but I'm not sure if that means at the mag itself or at the mag shaft.  Regardless, I should still be able to compensate with pulley selection shouldn't I?

Scottie

Offline thefrenchowl

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #143 on: January 11, 2014, 12:21:00 PM »
Hi Scottie,

I think you'll always be better driving a supercharger from the primary drive...

You need to spin it a lot faster than the engine to get the boost, probably as a minimum at 1.5 faster... So just imagine the tortion inertia on your crank as you shut the throttle and the charger still wants to spin if you drive it from the timing side... The crank might hold, but will your bearings hold?

Ansin driven from crank means reverse rotation, seems OK, mine does, and at 11.000rpm at top engine revs...

Patrick
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...What exactly are we trying to do here?...

Offline thefrenchowl

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #144 on: January 13, 2014, 05:53:56 PM »
Photo of Don Sliger's RE single engined bike back in the day, Speed Week 1972.



Patrick
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...What exactly are we trying to do here?...

Offline Scottie J

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #145 on: January 19, 2014, 11:41:32 AM »
I'm going to be picking up my old '83 Suzuki GS550ESD this week and I'm going to be using the rear swing arm, wheel, brake and suspension from it.  I'm going to keep the Enfield front end for now, but I'll be completely rebuilding the forks and installing the fork brace that mounts the 2 fork legs together for smoother operation.  I'll also be installing an aftermarket steering damper per the recommendations of Hitchcock's.  They also recommended running a flat tracker style front wheel (being that I don't need front brakes) to help relieve un-sprung fork weight.

I know that a person or 2 had mentioned earlier that I need to change the head angle for better high-speed control.  I have never done this, but am perfectly capable of doing so, and I'm curious what degree angle you guys would recommend going with?  Also, is there anything special of I need to keep in mind while doing this mod?  Any recommendations on steering dampers is appreciated too.  Thanks!

Scottie

Offline Koncretekid

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #146 on: January 20, 2014, 07:11:36 AM »
Scottie,
You would be wise to do a search on this site for "trail", which is the true measure of a bike's ability to maintain a straight line.  Trail is the distance between a line drawn down to the ground thru your steering stem (not your forks), and a second line drawn vertically down thru your front axle. The other measurement you need is the set back of the steering tube behind the centerline of the fork tubes.  Modern bikes use a rake angle (head angle) of around 25 degrees, but have less setback of the steering stem from the fork tube centerline.  Older bikes used 30 degrees or more, but had more setback.  4" of trail or more are generally recommended for stability, but longer bikes may need more.  I've heard the number 7% of you wheelbase but cannot confirm that that is the magic number.  My bike uses 30 degrees of rake with only 1-5/8" of set back with a 72" wheelbase, which results in 4-1/8" of trail, which is about 6% of the wheelbase and works well so far (145 mph).

Steering dampers are a big question, as well.  I've heard it said, set it as tight as possible, others say don't.  If your steering geometry is good, and your components (forks, triple clamps, front axle clamps) are well designed and strong enough to prevent one one fork moving independently from the other, the steering damper will probably not even be needed, as the bike will have little or no tendency to get into a speed wobble.  But if you do get into a wobble, then the steering damper is supposed to control it.  Doesn't always work that way, especially if you hit a bump while accelerating at high speed.  (Try putting the front wheel between your knees and try to move the handlebars.  If you can twist them, your steering system is probably not strong enough.  Try this with your old Indian, then try it on a modern bike in good condition with upside down forks.  You will feel the difference.)

I should also mention that the strongest front end in the world will not make up for frame flexing nor swing arm nor rear axle flexing.  Any weakness which could allow misalignment of the front and rear wheels is going to wreak havoc with handling.  Just ask the boys who used to race the old Kawi triples!

Tom
« Last Edit: January 20, 2014, 07:19:28 AM by Koncretekid »
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Offline Briz

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #147 on: January 20, 2014, 08:25:35 AM »
Between 35 & 40 degrees will work well.
Never known a bike with that much rake to get into a speed wobble.
No real disadvantage to lots of trail in a straightliner.

Offline Scottie J

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #148 on: January 20, 2014, 09:17:51 AM »
Perfect!  Thanks guys, that was the info I was looking for.  Rough figures and terminology.  I've only heard "rake" before and wasn't sure what to look up.

And about these Aisin AMR blowers.......  KE Motorsport just recently changed their website and now have the AMR300 listed for "250cc-1000cc" and the AMR500 for "1000cc-1600cc".  My motor should be VERY close to 742cc when I'm finished, and obviously I want some big boost down low.  Am I better off overdriving the AMR300 or underdriving the AMR500?  My gut tells me I should overdrive the 300, but I've never blown a bike before and am not familiar with these superchargers.  Also any links to help get me informed on these blowers would be appreciated.  I haven't had much luck finding useful information about them, just general stuff.

Scottie

Offline TheBaron

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Re: My '59 Enfield /Indian 750cc Chief High Compression Build
« Reply #149 on: January 20, 2014, 10:10:35 AM »
Scottie,

Go with the 500 as it will turn much slower for the same boost pressure and this is a big deal due to "fuel mixture heating" in  a fast spinning roots blower...

I'm running an Aisin 300 on a 350cc pushrod twin and at 9 psi boost I'm having real charge heating issues that have to be addressed.

Drive the blower off the crank... It is taking about 5 hp from the crank to drive my blower at the current boost/rpm level. Imagine that load going quickly off-on when you shift gears....

Robert