A or APS bike engine question...

[thecarfarmer]

Let's say a guy wanted to build a Special Construction type bike with an engine of a type that had never been offered in a production motorcycle.  Real 'orphan' stuff, like a steam engine, turbonique turbine or a 3 liter diesel. 

But the rule book has that phrase requiring the engine to be a 'motorcycle engine'...

Would there be some other way to run the bike?

Or, would the guy be stuck having to run a 'motorcycle' engine - like a 502 inch 'Boss Hoss' motor?

Thanks in advance!

-Bill

[Dakzila]

Interesting and clever..... I like the idea of the 502 in a LSR bike...better yet a 600 ci Hemi 

In the 2012 SCTA rule book it states;

Section 7.G Special construction -A, APS (pagfe 119)

7.G.9 Engine: (page 120)
"Any single or dual combination of motorcycle engine is permitted. No more than two engines are permitted. Maxium total engine displacement limit for the motorcycle is unlimited."

Since the rule book does not state anything about the engine being offered in a production motorcycle, but does state " motorcycle" engine, I would think that would exclude any engine that was not manufactured by a motorcycle manufacture, just my opinion through..

I hope you find a class to run in...I like your ideas and your thinking outside the box.

Buzz1513B

[Nortonist 592]

Bill,  I believe, under the rules for Omega class, you can run a diesel.  Last year at SpeedWeek there was a diesel bike and the engine was NOT from a motorcycle.  There was a discussion a while back about Boss Hoss motorcycles in the production class and as far as I can remember you're backing a loser there.  I don't know offhand where its written but car engines are not allowed in the motorcycle classes but motorcycle engines are allowed in car classes.

I think you would have to figure what you want to run and if it doesn't fit (or appear to fit) into current classes email Tom or Matt and get their ruling on it.

After seeing that diesel last year I have a very hard time figuring why anyone would want to run a diesel.

[Dakin Engineering]

I know AMA has differnt rules; Just heard a blown V-twin diesel go by.

Sam
#6062

[Dakzila]

Bill,  I believe, under the rules for Omega class, you can run a diesel.  Last year at SpeedWeek there was a diesel bike and the engine was NOT from a motorcycle.  There was a discussion a while back about Boss Hoss motorcycles in the production class and as far as I can remember you're backing a loser there.  I don't know offhand where its written but car engines are not allowed in the motorcycle classes but motorcycle engines are allowed in car classes.

I think you would have to figure what you want to run and if it doesn't fit (or appear to fit) into current classes email Tom or Matt and get their ruling on it.

After seeing that diesel last year I have a very hard time figuring why anyone would want to run a diesel.

Not sure if the SCTA allows diesel or two cycle in the Omega Class.
The wording of the section is somewhat unclear.

In section
 7.J.13 it says " An engine using a thermodynamic cycle other than Otto, two Cycle or Diesel."

To me the coma indicates you can use an Otto, Two cycle or Diesel in the Omega Class. But that's just my opinion!

Buzz1513B

[thecarfarmer]

Thanks for the replies, all!

Yeah, kinda' like the thought of a 10 liter Hemi... my bank account won't tolerate the 502 Chev either, so may as well dream big.

 

As I look at the rule, I would bet today's lunch money on Ω being: other than otto, other than 2 stroke, or other than diesel - as in none of those three. 

Honestly, I was wondering why nobody'd run the big Chev - it was legitimately installed into a ton of motorcycles; assembled at the factory.  Not that I'd trade my Sportster for one of those things (apart from the fact that I could sell the Boss Hogg, buy my XL back, and probably have enough left over for a Kawi H2)...

My thought is to build something that hasn't been done before.  Having now been to Speed Week, I can see that this in itself is a tall order. 

-Bill

[dw230]

"As I look at the rule, I would bet today's lunch money on Ω being: other than otto, other than 2 stroke, or other than diesel - as in none of those three."

Ding dong - right answer.

DW 

[Dakzila]

Thanks for the replies, all!

Yeah, kinda' like the thought of a 10 liter Hemi... my bank account won't tolerate the 502 Chev either, so may as well dream big.

 

As I look at the rule, I would bet today's lunch money on Ω being: other than otto, other than 2 stroke, or other than diesel - as in none of those three. 

Honestly, I was wondering why nobody'd run the big Chev - it was legitimately installed into a ton of motorcycles; assembled at the factory.  Not that I'd trade my Sportster for one of those things (apart from the fact that I could sell the Boss Hogg, buy my XL back, and probably have enough left over for a Kawi H2)...

My thought is to build something that hasn't been done before.  Having now been to Speed Week, I can see that this in itself is a tall order. 

-Bill

And I agree,  you would still have your lunch money..... I left out an  "t.
I meant to say. "To me the coma indicates you can't use an Otto, Two cycle or Diesel in the Omega Class.

Buzz 1513B

[Moxnix]

Run at BUB.

[grumm441]

Run at BUB.

what Max said
G

[Nortonist 592]

Or build an "ordinary" bike and think traditional like I do.

[salt27]

Or build an "ordinary" bike and think traditional like I do.

Now that was sarcasm at its finest.

  Don

[Dean Los Angeles]

I don't have a rule book in front of me, but I remember omega class only running in streamliner.

A two stroke or diesel in motorcycle classes is the same as a four stroke.

The diesel would have to run in the fuel class.

If the diesel could run in the gas class you might have something. Diesel fuel can produce more power than gasoline. Diesel vs nitro . . . not so much.

[Trouble]

I don't have a rule book in front of me, but I remember omega class only running in streamliner.

A two stroke or diesel in motorcycle classes is the same as a four stroke.

The diesel would have to run in the fuel class.

If the diesel could run in the gas class you might have something. Diesel fuel can produce more power than gasoline. Diesel vs nitro . . . not so much.

Diesel has 20% more energy stored in it.  However, you are capped at about 6000 rpm, and gasoline will go over 18,000 rpm.  Speed of vaporization thingy.  To vaporize diesel in a few millisecs takes more heat than you can generate with air.  If you did get the air hot enough to do it, it would melt stuff.  Even the $10 million Audi's don't spin to 7.

Diesel racing is akin to racing antique cars.  They are not designed to race, but you do it for fun.  The only reason Audi did so well was how the rules were written.  They adjust the intake restrictor sizes.

[Trouble]

...
But the rule book has that phrase requiring the engine to be a 'motorcycle engine'...

...

Odd.  How do you run an electric car motor then?  There are production electric motorcycles, but those motors aren't used, are they?