(Note: LANDRACING.COM donations are not tax deductible)


This is a public forum. The opinions expressed here don't
necessarily reflect the feelings of The Folks That Run The Site (that's us)
unless we explicitly say so, ok?


Author Topic: Inline-four crankshaft  (Read 216697 times)

0 Members and 4 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Jack Gifford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
  • Age: 79
  • Location: Phelps, NY
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #150 on: September 14, 2014, 12:36:46 AM »
Once more, pure luck trumped any of my planning. :-D I had neglected to discuss with Joe (at Moldex) the oiling scheme for this crank. So I was happy to see that it has straight-shot oiling- but that was more due to Joe's experience, than luck. The "luck" concerns the layout of oil delivery to the rod journals; in general, each main journal (#5, 4, 3, & 2) delivers oil to the rod throw just in front of it. This leaves main #1 with no demand for the "extra" flow volume of a rod- whoopee! This is great news for a Pontiac engine, in which the front main is farthest from the supply-end of the oil gallery.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2014, 12:38:42 AM by Jack Gifford »
M/T Pontiac hemi guru (or does guru status expire after 30 years?)

Offline ratpatrol66

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 168
  • Location: Arlington, WA
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #151 on: September 24, 2014, 03:27:02 AM »
Hello Jack, Any chance your going to tease us with pictures of your crank? Darn that sounds so wrong! You know what I mean.

Offline Jack Gifford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
  • Age: 79
  • Location: Phelps, NY
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #152 on: September 24, 2014, 10:18:10 PM »
Camera died, and I'm not much for pictures anyway. It's just a crankshaft. I try to shoot pictures when there's something unique or unusual. For instance, once I've got prototype pieces ready for spin-testing of my full-circle counterweight scheme, I'll take photos; and hopefully, eventually of the crank with all eight full-circle counterweights in place.
M/T Pontiac hemi guru (or does guru status expire after 30 years?)

Offline jacksoni

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1204
  • Age: 75
  • Location: Annapolis, Maryland
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #153 on: October 10, 2014, 09:03:51 PM »
Jack- Have you gotten any further on the pulley/belt issue for your cam drive? And what are you using for an idler?
Jack Iliff
 G/BGS-250.235 1987
 G/GC- 176.245  2018
 G/GMS-182.144 2019

Offline Jack Gifford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
  • Age: 79
  • Location: Phelps, NY
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #154 on: October 11, 2014, 12:11:52 AM »
No, I haven't yet sourced the cam drives; sort of put that aside while working on more immediate stuff- built the oil pan, inspected the billet crank, designing the full-circle counterweight scheme and test facility, finalize connecting rod details and get them ordered, etc.
I'll use a pair of flanged idlers, outboard of the belt and about midway between crank and cams. The idlers themselves are easily available from stock (Gates), and I've finished machining a 'beefy' mounting plate (5/8" thick) that bolts to the front of both the head and the block, and has slotted holes for idler studs. Incorporated into the plate is a 'shunt' passage for coolant flow from the front of the block up to the head (engine is dry-decked)- one piece of plumbing eliminated!
« Last Edit: October 11, 2014, 12:13:24 AM by Jack Gifford »
M/T Pontiac hemi guru (or does guru status expire after 30 years?)

Offline RichFox

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2611
  • Location: San Mateo, Ca
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #155 on: October 11, 2014, 08:31:00 PM »
I have some pulleys and an idler from a Gold Wing. pretty nice and quite cheap. Of course I only use them to drive oil and fuel pumps. But they work for Honda. 

Offline Jack Gifford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
  • Age: 79
  • Location: Phelps, NY
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #156 on: October 11, 2014, 11:42:09 PM »
Designing "by proven example" (aftermarket belt cam drives of race V8 engines with cam loads/speeds similar to mine), I've decided the belt should be 8mm pitch and at least 30mm wide (170 tooth, 53.5", characteristics of Gates PowerGrip TT2 series). I haven't yet seen such an OEM drive.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2014, 12:30:09 AM by Jack Gifford »
M/T Pontiac hemi guru (or does guru status expire after 30 years?)

Offline Buickguy3

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1026
  • Age: 75
  • Location: Columbus,Mt.
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #157 on: October 16, 2014, 08:57:15 PM »
   I think I found a video of your crankshaft in production. Facinating.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81UjjSH2iFw

    Doug  :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
I keep going faster and faster and I don't know why. All I have to do is live and die.
                   [America]

Offline Jack Gifford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
  • Age: 79
  • Location: Phelps, NY
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #158 on: October 17, 2014, 12:54:31 AM »
I enjoy that video. But my crank is more "old school"- from Joe at Moldex!
However- The shaping of the webs and counterweights appears like they may have been done by CNC. I'm hoping they were- I''ll call Joe and ask. CNC data would allow Moldex to quite easily create a single web/counterweight for my validation-testing of the filler-segment scheme (spinning it to 9,500 RPM + 20% safety factor- in a [hopefully] burst-proof housing.
M/T Pontiac hemi guru (or does guru status expire after 30 years?)

Offline Jack Gifford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
  • Age: 79
  • Location: Phelps, NY
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #159 on: October 29, 2014, 12:37:29 AM »
No such luck- counterweight "profiling" by Moldex was not CNC'd. :cry: So I'm stuck with doing my own analog measuring to re-create one counterweight for testing.
M/T Pontiac hemi guru (or does guru status expire after 30 years?)

Offline Jack Gifford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
  • Age: 79
  • Location: Phelps, NY
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #160 on: February 10, 2015, 01:48:31 AM »
I finally received a sample piece of Elektron-43 wrought magnesium, along with a design manual for these alloys. Made a steel replica of one of the crank webs and an explosion-resistant housing to use to validate the design of filler segments and attachment scheme. Bought pulleys needed to turn it up to 12,000 RPM, and put together a sheet metal enclosure for the pulleys and belt. Almost finished machining one magnesium segment- then the sample web & filler will go to the balance shop before test-spinning.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2015, 02:36:21 AM by Jack Gifford »
M/T Pontiac hemi guru (or does guru status expire after 30 years?)

Offline Jack Gifford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
  • Age: 79
  • Location: Phelps, NY
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #161 on: February 10, 2015, 02:38:13 AM »
More pictures.
M/T Pontiac hemi guru (or does guru status expire after 30 years?)

Offline fordboy628

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2262
  • Age: 3
  • Location: Koozebane
  • GONE FISHIN' . . .
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #162 on: February 10, 2015, 05:33:43 AM »
Jack,

Have you got a magnesium capable fire extinguisher in your shop?    Just in case . . . . .

I've witnessed 2 mag fires started by dry machining, neither was fun, or did the shop any good.

Be prepared my friend.
 :cheers:
Fordboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline tauruck

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4903
  • Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #163 on: February 10, 2015, 07:14:14 AM »
All that glitter flyin around, man!!!!!.
Remember those Verco Type raised letters on wedding invitations?.
Magnesium powder over wet ink.
Well an older guy I knew gave me some powder and a little recipe.
My hearing ain't that great these days. :-D

Offline Rex Schimmer

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2378
  • Age: 76
  • Location: Fulton, CA
  • Only time and money prevent completion!
Re: Inline-four crankshaft
« Reply #164 on: February 10, 2015, 12:52:04 PM »
Jack,
Your "12,000 rpm test to destruction" reminds me of a story told to me by Duane Korn, former owner of H&L Metals in Signal Hill, Ca. (H&L was the go to place to have tubing bent in So Cal for years) Duane was one of the original members of SEMA, which at that time stood for "Speed Equipment Manufactures Assoc." and one of the SEMA members made racing flywheels and clutches ,don't remember the companies name, anyway he decided to make a test cell in which he was going to spin one of his flywheels up until it exploded. Duane said the guy built a big steel box from 1/2 inch plate, fully welded all around with a 1/2 plate door that allowed you to mount the flywheel to a shaft that was spun by an electric motor with gearing that would make it go to 10,000 rpm+. The door had heavy steel hinges and was bolted closed with 1/2 inch bolts. Well they had the initial testing and most of the SEMA members were there to watch the "blast". The guy starts the thing up and he starts to ramp up the speed and Duane said he started to move to the very back part of the room! When it blew up at around 10,000 the box turned into a "ball" and the door was almost blown off! So be careful!!!

Rex
Rex

Not much matters and the rest doesn't matter at all.