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« Reply #30 on: October 22, 2011, 08:45:05 AM » |
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It does, as in steering the whole axle assembly.
Sid.
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RogerL
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« Reply #31 on: October 22, 2011, 11:32:55 AM » |
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i guess i had better chime in here. my car is a "wagon steer" (AWD) and it handles just fine, been over 330 a number of times. i will offer that it requires careful attention to the design, thanks to the Riley Tech guys for getting it right. i also go through a set up procedure on scale pads prior to heading to the salt each year. we know that along with setup to balance the corners, getting matched tire circumferences side to side is very important.
we plan to be back on the salt with a little more HP next year so expect to up our 330 numbers considerably.
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Freud
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« Reply #32 on: October 22, 2011, 12:37:13 PM » |
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Isn't the term "wagon steering" as compared to Wagon Wheel steering?
FREUD
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Since '63
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kiwi belly tank
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« Reply #33 on: October 22, 2011, 01:11:46 PM » |
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The "official explanation " I got from SCTA would make Rodgerl's car illegal.
Looks like we have a rule clarification required here.
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RogerL
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« Reply #34 on: October 22, 2011, 03:06:56 PM » |
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my car is "illegal" per the rules. not sure when the rule came into effect but we were will down the road on the project. i was able to work with the officials to demonstrate our design is not a problem. we went up to speed in 25 mile/hour increments with observers down the course to watch for problems. in my application, i actually believe the desire is safer (and it works) than a conventional setup. sometimes the rule making process is a reaction to a problem. simply making a particular design illegal across the board is not always the best approach. i remember not too many years ago there was a push to make flat bottom cars illegal. interestingly the worlds fast wheel driven car is a flat bottom car. i am not an advocate for allowing wagon steering across the board in all classes or even in the special construction category. but if a design can be demonstrated to be safe, why not allow it, it's what Bonneville is all about in my opinion.
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Rex Schimmer
Hero Member
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Age: 70
Location: Fulton, CA
Posts: 1474
Only time and money prevent completion!
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« Reply #35 on: October 22, 2011, 05:34:19 PM » |
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Obviously Roger and his design group studied the challenges with wagon steering and came up with a design that worked and if he has gone over 330 it appears to work well. I agree with Roger that just outlawing something out of hand because some one did it and didn't get it right is not what should be happening but it is probably easier for SCTA tech to do it this way as it doesn't require them to go through an engineering exercise to decide if the design is workable. That is probably the same reason hydraulic steering is outlawed as it can certainly be made to work and it would be an attractive option on very long cars (Marlo Treit's car is using hydraulic steering, I think)but it would not be simple and as I am sure most of the SCTA inspectors are not ,nor should they be required to be, hydraulic engineers it is justifiable to just not allow hydraulic steering.
Rex
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Rex
Not much matters and the rest doesn't matter at all.
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John Burk
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Age: 72
Location: Hainesport , New Jersey
Posts: 419
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« Reply #36 on: October 22, 2011, 06:46:58 PM » |
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With a center pivoting axel the scrub is half the tread width . For a drive axel some kind of high ratio worm screw steering with no feed back to the steering wheel sounds like the only it could work .
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Bob Drury
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« Reply #37 on: October 22, 2011, 08:03:48 PM » |
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Keep in mind that Marlo's car (which is over forty feet long and DOES infact have hydraulic steering) only has about six degrees or so of steering.
If in fact there were a steering failure, there wouldn't be much of a change in direction given the amount of caster and length of the wheelbase, in my opinion.
U-turns are out of the question except possibly at Lake Gardiner............... Bob
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Bob Drury
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« Reply #38 on: October 22, 2011, 08:48:04 PM » |
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We all know the rule book is not perfect, thats why it gets tweaked regularly. I would say it's a credit to Rodgerl & his guys to have got it to work but this also brings up another question.
If you set a record in an "illegal car" where do you stand??
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RogerL
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« Reply #39 on: October 22, 2011, 08:57:19 PM » |
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the car has passed inspections by both the SCTA and the USFRA, after we got through the check out process. we have been accepted for the class we run in by both sanctioning bodies, the stickers are on the car.
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kiwi belly tank
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« Reply #40 on: October 23, 2011, 12:10:04 AM » |
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In order for a vehicle to be making runs, it has to have gone through tech but as we know, they can still be illegal under the rules. Thats where the protest system comes in, many of which have been upheld over the years & people have had their records taken away.
Incidentally, I have just finished up the steering on my 4WD streamliner, that is over 40ft long & has conventional steering. If I can pick off a record, I plan on being legal when I get there.
Sid.
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Stan Back
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« Reply #41 on: October 23, 2011, 06:56:12 PM » |
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I wouldn't think it would be kosher to protest a "safety" rule if it showed that it was in no way a possible performance advantage.
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Member of the San Berdoo Roadsters – California's most-exclusive roadster club.
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woz
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« Reply #43 on: November 18, 2011, 08:39:00 PM » |
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racefanwfo
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Age: 57
Location: sherman oaks,california
Posts: 238
jenks worlds fastest pitbull
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« Reply #44 on: November 18, 2011, 08:52:51 PM » |
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Why is danny trying to go 420mph when everyone else in the class is trying to go 500mph.
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I love it when a plan comes together!
col john "Hannibal" smith leader of the A-TEAM.
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