Author Topic: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category  (Read 7777 times)

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Offline dw230

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New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« on: July 20, 2011, 06:36:37 PM »
New rules for these classes can be found on pages 69 & 74. I recieved a clarification in response to a question I was asked. I would like to share the details for everyone's education.

"The radiator needs to be in the approximate stock location, at least as large an open area as the stock unit and must not have the airflow through it blocked or obstructed in any way. You can mount anything between the opening and the radiator but it can in no way restrict, redirect, obstruct, impede or otherwise alter the airflow between the grill opening and the radiator. Considering that putting pretty much anything in an airstream blocks some of the flow then we take a very hard look at anything mounted between the opening and the radiator. The competitor will have a uphill battle trying to convince us that it is legal.

A primary aerodynamic difference between a production classes and the altered classes is the penalty the former pays for having air flowing through the radiator & engine bay. This is a core difference. Altering this penalty by definition takes you out of production.

Here is an (incomplete) list of things that people try to do to minimize the aero penalty of air going through your radiator:

Put a plate over the front of it
Put a plate over the back of it
Put a tank in front of it
Put a duct in front of it, redirecting the air
Mount it at an angle
Make it smaller with the resulting hole blocked off
Tape over the grill
Fill the fin area with a foreign substance
etc.......
all of the above (and more) will bump you to Altered or get you thrown out of impound if you arrive as a production or a Gas Coupe.

Things like oil coolers, intercoolers and A/C condensers are an area that requires closer scrutiny. Putting a oil cooler in front of the radiator is fine so long as the thing actually lets air flow through it and into the radiator behind. That’s common in production cars and street vehicles since the dawn of time. But, stacking 7 disconnected oil coolers with dented fins in front of the radiator is not OK, that would be artificially blocking the air through the radiator. Putting an air conditioning condenser in front of it would also be OK providing it was stock for the vehicle entered and functions properly (still lets air pass through it to the radiator, not that the A/C blows cold). If it is not the stock part then no, that would be artificially blocking the air through the radiator. Intercoolers are also an area of potential abuse. They are pretty much required and if a stock one was available it will not be big enough so a larger one will commonly be fitted. Again, as long as it is allowing air to pass through it and to the radiator then it would be OK, provided that it is actually being used on a turbocharged engine.

We don't care if you make your radiator taller, wider or thicker, just not smaller. We don't care if you move it from the passenger side to the driver’s side or vice-versa so long as you are paying the full penalty of the aero drag caused by the radiator airflow into the engine bay that is fundamental to a production vehicle. If you are not then you should be (by definition) in altered.

Determining if a car is legal is easy. Simply look at the radiator & grill opening. If the airflow is impeded in any way that is not stock or something you would not see on a real street driven vehicle then it is not legal for production. It doesn’t matter how you did it, it just matters that you are attempting to block the air flow thru the radiator.

If the airflow is restricted from stock because of a realistic need then that is ok. Oil coolers, Intercoolers, etc… etc fall into this category, as does thicker radiators. Common sense is used here. If it is legitimately needed then it’s OK but watch for shenanigans. This is where a person will put a 4 inch thick, ultra fine pitch radiator that covers 100% of the engine radiator, plumb engine oil to it and call it an oil cooler. Then stack an identical unit in front of that but with A/T fluid. That’s blocking the radiator air unnecessarily and illegal. We just have to use common sense. A good test is if you believe the vehicle could drive in stop & go traffic on a 100F day on the street in the presented configuration assuming the radiator was flowing 100% water and air fans were present and a stock engine was in the car. In short, can enough air still get through to satisfy the stock vehicles worst case use?"

These are the factors used to enforce this rule.
DW

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Offline SPARKY

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2011, 07:20:42 PM »
 :evil: is IS is or is it not  :-o
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Offline Buickguy3

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2011, 09:25:50 PM »
  Dan,
     If we have a 19"x27" radiator, but the original radiator was 19"x32", and we don't block any of the original open gap with anything, there will actually be additional air going into the compartment. Is there a problem with that, or do we have to have another larger radiator made to fill in the old hole? Not trying to pull any tricks, but that size was readily available at the time.
   Doug  :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
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Offline gearheadeh

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2011, 09:40:18 PM »
Dan,Now that was one of the best posts ever on rule clarification. If you are like me your index fingers must be sore after pluckin your way thru all of that! Great job! Thankyou.  :cheers:
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Offline dw230

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2011, 10:05:06 PM »
I used cut/paste from an email - ah technology.

Doug, as stated common sense can be applied. I don't write these things. Contact Bobby Sykes Jr.

DW
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Offline oldracer19

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2011, 10:08:36 PM »
Thanks Dan for your efforts. A well done clarification. Your work is much appreciated. :cheers:
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Offline BudJ63

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2011, 10:16:59 AM »
  Dan,
     If we have a 19"x27" radiator, but the original radiator was 19"x32", and we don't block any of the original open gap with anything, there will actually be additional air going into the compartment. Is there a problem with that, or do we have to have another larger radiator made to fill in the old hole? Not trying to pull any tricks, but that size was readily available at the time.
   Doug  :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

"We don't care if you make your radiator taller, wider or thicker, just not smaller"

Pretty clear.

Offline jacksoni

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2011, 08:14:15 AM »
Ok, I will ask as no one has- knowing the answer I suspect. Some cars have grill opening below the bumper (some like the 82-91 Firebird have no grill opening and take air from under the car). Air Dams are legal in all classes. How does the opening- if any- in the air dam need to match what is behind it. That opening is not blocked off- but there is redirection of air flow. Reason being I have seen some cars labeled /GC with no opening in the dam, or with a smaller opening. I am presuming this will be closely scrutinized, so would like to be sure before arriving in impound--- :-)
Jack Iliff
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Offline dw230

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2011, 11:22:25 AM »
In Gas Coupe class it will be up to the competitor to provide the square inch area of the OEM opening so that it can be compared to the opening in the air dam.

DW
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Offline oldracer19

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2011, 12:30:24 AM »
"Air Dams are legal in all classes."

Not true for production classes. Only such as was available as OEM option.
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Offline dw230

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2011, 12:51:48 AM »
Oldracer - I read the entire thread agin. Where did you pick up that quote.

DW
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Offline maguromic

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2011, 02:25:41 AM »
"Air Dams are legal in all classes."

Not true for production classes. Only such as was available as OEM option.

This rule is like the "any frame rule" and other rules in the general rules.  But specific class rules override them. Tony
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Offline jacksoni

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2011, 06:54:27 AM »
Oldracer - I read the entire thread agin. Where did you pick up that quote.

DW
Dan, I said that. In production legal as long, as Oldracer points out, they are factory equivalent. Though technically correct, my statement is misleading as noted. Sorry.
Jack Iliff
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  G/FAlt- 193.934 2021 (196.033 best)
 G/GMS-182.144 2019

Offline dw230

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2011, 11:26:40 PM »
OK Jack, I missed that.

DW
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Offline 1 fast evo 2

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Re: New radiator rule for Gas Coupe and Production Category
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2011, 09:26:08 PM »
I have a question concerning the production super charged class.
My current set-up has a small radiator to make room for the placement of the turbo.
The whole grill opening would be open and there would be even greater and easier access for the incoming air.
Would this be legal or not ?
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