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Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => Build Diaries => Topic started by: Stainless1 on January 04, 2011, 10:48:19 AM

Title: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on January 04, 2011, 10:48:19 AM
Well Mad Max, the Kansas Badman is at it again.

When Max and I removed the parachutes from the Black Lightning we noticed a problem.  It appears the tethers may have burned during the last deployment.  Trying to understand if it was a packing issue that can be avoided or what.  The burns are within a foot of the covered attachment portion.  Max uses the bags in a tube arrangement, does not look like it is a tube issue so I am figuring maybe how it was packed.  Anyone out there ever see anything like this?  Will probably send the pictures and/or the tethers to Stroud.
two pictures of each line, one was burned through leaving a single line holding the chute, the other partially burned through.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Glen on January 04, 2011, 11:23:15 AM
Stainless, how about a couple of pictures of the tube and attachment for a better idea of the area of concern. I know that some run a section of fire sleeve near the attachment area or around any heat source.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on January 04, 2011, 12:51:33 PM
I have a few and I will take more.  The tether is canvas covered for about 30 inches, the burns are at the 40 inch or so area.  There is nothing hot back there.

the ear in the 3rd pic is half of the attach point for the 2 chutes.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Glen on January 04, 2011, 01:04:22 PM
Any pictures with the tether attached and showing the actual failure point beyond the end of the tubes, any pictures with the chute deployed at speed to show the canopy position in relation to the back of the bike?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on January 04, 2011, 10:49:04 PM
Let me do some searching, if not I can take one of the tether attached.  Have some pics from Ray that I need to go through, might be a chute pic in there
thanks Glen
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: WhizzbangK.C. on January 05, 2011, 09:13:57 AM
Those burns don't look like they happened with the lines under tension. I'd be looking for somewhere on the bike that has residue stuck to it from the contact. Almost looks like they came in contact with a very hot, sharp edge, like the end of an exhaust pipe.

Is there any chance that after the run, while the chute was being gathered up, that it was draped over the body of the liner and the lines hit a still hot pipe?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on January 05, 2011, 11:20:34 PM
Whizz, nothing back there that close to the tethers.  One of them is 3 ft from the attach point, the other is a little over 2.  I am guessing friction as the tether deployed, just trying to wrap my mind around how it happened. 
Come on down and take a look, surely you get to Wichita now and then. 

More info, the tubes are 2 feet long, pictures soon
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: hitz on January 06, 2011, 01:32:58 AM
have to take a wild guess!

Any chance it may be a spilled chemical? We do use some potent cleaners and such. I found a melted place on my arm restraints near the loose end. It looked like a iron of some kind was laid on it. It looks like the end of the strap is sealed with some kind of heat tool during manufacture, maybe it was laid down on the strap by accident, it will probably be OK, it has a current SFI tag on it. :|

OK I'll go to bed now. It's way past my bed time.

Harvey
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Richard 2 on January 06, 2011, 11:31:24 AM
Whizz, nothing back there that close to the tethers.  One of them is 3 ft from the attach point, the other is a little over 2.  I am guessing friction as the tether deployed, just trying to wrap my mind around how it happened.   Come on down and take a look, surely you get to Wichita now and then. 

More info, the tubes are 2 feet long, pictures soon

SS, Is there any holes in the canvas? If it was caused by friction and the tether was covered by canvas I would think there would be a hole in the canvas.
Just thinking about it Rick
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on April 23, 2011, 11:14:36 AM
OK, we have decided that the chute may have been packed with some of the front at the back and the nylon on nylon friction burned the tethers.  Here are a few more pictures, as you can see, nothing back there to burn anything but line movement... all I can suggest to everyone is be careful how you pack your chutes and carefully manage where you put what parts.  Thanks to everyone including Rex S and Tom B for the indepth analysis of our issues and suggestions on how to avoid a future problem.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on April 23, 2011, 11:36:54 AM
Well I mentioned that Max was thinking of going solid on last years Black Lightning thread
http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,7135.150.html
Well, Max started feeling good after several of his medical issues got worked and he went out in the garage and started hacking, the swing arm is gone, the shock mounts are gone, oh, everything is gone and by the time I got my camera over there he was putting it back together.
As you can see, when Max decides to do something he commits to it
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: saltwheels262 on April 23, 2011, 12:01:46 PM
glad to know max and team are going at
it again in '11.

good luck.

franey
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on April 23, 2011, 12:02:24 PM
OK, the slacker photog didn't get the first pics up until he took more....  :roll:
Max sent me home with some homework pieces, those can be seen as adjusters, Max had them 85%, I just finished them.
Max has a little more done now, as you can see, he only had one side primed.  
Mac decided to do this before the motor and tranny so the proper ride level could be measured.  This change to solid will eliminate the tight / loose chain condition issues that happen when your drive and pivot point are a foot or more apart.  He thinks that might have led to the output trans bearing problem last year.  Since the hack is also solid, he thought that was causing some issues based on suspension to sidecar movement giving uncommanded lean angles requiring steering input.  Hopefully my explanation is understandable... I know what I mean...  :-o  :-D
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Freud on April 23, 2011, 12:10:13 PM
I am impressed by his dedication to bench grinders.

He certainly is laid back. Try to get a foto of him scratching.

FREUD
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: jdincau on April 23, 2011, 12:35:23 PM
I am impressed by his dedication to bench grinders.

FREUD

Looks just right to me Freud, one for making things sharp, one for making things dull and one for polishing things.
Jim
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: SPARKY on April 23, 2011, 01:43:31 PM
Yep-- :?--that is the LSR special construction positition-- :-D--sitting there waiting for it to tell you what it wants  :cheers:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on April 24, 2011, 12:07:07 AM
Yep-- :?--that is the LSR special construction positition-- :-D--sitting there waiting for it to tell you what it wants  :cheers:

WOW, you know I never really thought about it but that is profound.... Sooner or later it will tell you what is next.  I think I'll grab a beer and go listen to the liner...
 :cheers:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: hotrod on April 24, 2011, 12:16:36 AM
I have spent many hours in that position contemplating and listening to the metal whisper to me.

That is a profound statement and will be instantly recognized by any one why has engaged in a long one off project. They all will tell you what they need if you will just take the time to listen. Then sometimes what they are telling you, something you don't want to hear, like "this is not going to work - start over, and re-design this bracket!"

Larry
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: gearheadeh on April 24, 2011, 09:44:48 AM
 Hopefully my explanation is understandable... I know what I mean...  :-o  :-D

Yes it is.

The rear frame section is now a stressed frame member. Who am I to advise the great MAX ?
But I would look at strengthening the lower frame tubes(triangulation and bracing) just behind the drive sprocket!
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: SPARKY on April 24, 2011, 09:53:46 AM
:?  this comes under the heading of wanting to know or understand---why behind instead of just in front?  Behind would be in compression from chain drive forces in front would be in tension---inquiring mind would like to gain insights  :-P
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: gearheadeh on April 24, 2011, 10:08:22 AM
:?  this comes under the heading of wanting to know or understand---why behind instead of just in front?  Behind would be in compression from chain drive forces in front would be in tension---inquiring mind would like to gain insights  :-P

I was thinking of entire chassis flex under loading pulling on the lower tube where in joins the vertical tube (just behind the drive sprocket!)
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Vinsky on April 24, 2011, 08:27:36 PM
Knowing Max, if the situation calls for more gussets, you will eventually see them. Never known him to under-build anything.  Look close at that tire.. it came off Al Teague's streamliner.
John
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on April 25, 2011, 09:02:12 AM
:?  this comes under the heading of wanting to know or understand---why behind instead of just in front?  Behind would be in compression from chain drive forces in front would be in tension---inquiring mind would like to gain insights  :-P

I was thinking of entire chassis flex under loading pulling on the lower tube where in joins the vertical tube (just behind the drive sprocket!)


There's a part missing in the photo.  When installed it negates any flex of the vertical tube just behind the drive sprocket.  This part is a quite robust outboard carrier bearing that bolts to the transmission.  A quarter inch steel plate fits in the shoulder of the outboard carrier bearing made from 7075 T6.  The down tube is flanged and the quarter inch aluminum is bolted to the flange.  Zero flex on vertical down tube.  The lower tube and upper bi-angled tubing is 1 1/2" diameter, .090 wall chrome molley tubing.  If you can picture an "A" frame with the bottom legs separated outboard by 1 1/2" on each side, and the pull or stress point an additional 1 1/2" inboard; for a total of the inboard stress point--3".  Which makes it pretty much impossible for athort ship flex.  Up and down flex is negated by the upper frame tubing being triangulated to the circular athort ship frame tubing.  The design employs the rear hub axle as a stress member for tying the six frame tubes together. 

I've tested the flex by C clamping the installed chain.  I feel that I achieved more stress with this test than would be applied under heavy acceleration load.  I was unable to detect any flex whatsoever in the design.  Of course there's the next step, and that would be the Great White Dyno.

See you guys on the salt.

                                 Max
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on April 25, 2011, 10:34:26 PM
Look close at that tire.. it came off Al Teague's streamliner.

And, from Art Arfons before that, isn't that the story I heard?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Nortonist 592 on April 25, 2011, 10:53:56 PM
I am impressed by his dedication to bench grinders.

FREUD


Bench grinders.  The CNC machines of the finacially chalenged.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: manta22 on April 25, 2011, 11:10:14 PM
...or belt sanders.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Vinsky on April 25, 2011, 11:39:39 PM
"And, from Art Arfons before that, isn't that the story I heard?"

I think you've got that right Max.

Hope this is the year.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Ron Gibson on May 05, 2011, 11:22:54 PM
I went to Wichita to rescue my engine parts from the shop that repaired it's indigestion problem. Stainless was gracious enough to offer me a place to sleep, (Thanks Stainless). Today we went to Max's shop to check his liners progress and as usual, it seems, LOL, Stainless forgot his camera and Max was sitting there waiting for the bike to talk some more. Some progress has been made since the last pictures, but I didn't have a camera either. We had a interesating conversation with Max.
 Then we went and looked at the liner Tom Hannah is building. That is also a work of art.

Thanks Guys
Ron
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Dr Goggles on May 06, 2011, 12:27:56 AM
Yep-- :?--that is the LSR special construction positition-- :-D--sitting there waiting for it to tell you what it wants  :cheers:

WOW, you know I never really thought about it but that is profound.... Sooner or later it will tell you what is next.  I think I'll grab a beer and go listen to the liner...
 :cheers:
I have spent many hours in that position contemplating and listening to the metal whisper to me.

That is a profound statement and will be instantly recognized by any one why has engaged in a long one off project. They all will tell you what they need if you will just take the time to listen. Then sometimes what they are telling you, something you don't want to hear, like "this is not going to work - start over, and re-design this bracket!"

Larry

I miss that part, sitting there for hours staring at it.Hoping inspiration would sneak up behind me a strike me firmly....

If everything we made or bought was right the first time and I hadn't spent all that time sitting there staring at it It would have cost next to nothing and been built in no time.....badly. Instead it cost a lot , took ages aaaaaand................. :wink:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on May 21, 2011, 09:41:44 AM
Well I finally made it to Max's with the camera.  Max has gone mad! OK, not really, here are a couple of pictures of the progress.

Max has removed almost everything that is removable to clean and paint, the interior tub is out, the tranny will be coming out, everything is out.  Max is putting a little more steel bracing in the tub area, although I didn't get a picture of that.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on May 21, 2011, 09:45:42 AM
You can't see the solid rear very well in those pictures, but here is the finished product.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on May 21, 2011, 09:58:17 AM
Removing the rear suspension gave Max the opportunity to find a better spot for the external access fire bottles.  You can see it in the last picture but here is the new mount area.

if it looks like Max's progress is going the wrong way you have to understand him better... he found some rust, so he just kept taking it apart to make sure it was not an issue.  Then while it was all open, he decided to make some improvements he had been thinking about.... one thing led to another and the frame gets painted Monday.

Oh, here is a picture of the swing arm and side car frame, they have been to powder coat, as have the ballast weights.  In fact Max has sent a lot of the parts to get coated and painted.  His breathing does not allow him to do a lot of paint and body work, and he has a bunch of that planned, so he is picking what goes out and what stays in.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: SPARKY on May 21, 2011, 10:00:07 AM
Looks like some one has been mooting around ---A bunch !!!
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on May 31, 2011, 10:40:13 PM
Well, I think Max is done mucking with the frame, it is the way he wants it.  I say that because Max had it powdercoated.  We picked it up today... but first it gets the red carpet treatment.... no really... Max didn't want to scratch up any of the parts he is painting and coating, so he got a little chunk of carpet for the garage.   That's his daughter Kim hiding behind dad.

Max checked it out, they did a good job

So we strapped it to my 18 foot trailer and took it home
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on May 31, 2011, 10:42:47 PM
And it is back in the garage ready to start assembly tomorrow
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Tman on June 01, 2011, 11:21:39 AM
Looks good, I like the red carpet. I have a roll almost like that stashed for the same purpose.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on June 01, 2011, 12:13:22 PM
It`s nice to know their are still people out there that do it right or don`t do it at all.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 02, 2011, 12:06:50 AM
Looks good, I like the red carpet. I have a roll almost like that stashed for the same purpose.  :cheers:

Kinda gives the garage that "bordello" feel... not that I would know...  :roll:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Tman on June 02, 2011, 12:14:06 AM
Looks good, I like the red carpet. I have a roll almost like that stashed for the same purpose.  :cheers:

Kinda gives the garage that "bordello" feel... not that I would know...  :roll:

If that is Bordello the stuff I have is full on French whorehouse!
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Freud on June 02, 2011, 11:26:55 AM
What would be required to duplicate an Amsterdam room?

Who is qualified to answer that question?

FREUD
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Tman on June 02, 2011, 12:45:54 PM
What would be required to duplicate an Amsterdam room?

Who is qualified to answer that question?

FREUD

Porkpie? Or one of the other folks from across the pond? :-D
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: bak189 on June 02, 2011, 06:02:35 PM
Hey, your talking about my place of birth....Amsterdam....and I am qualified to answer that question....
First Max needs lots of red lights....once he gets those then we can go from there...........................
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Freud on June 02, 2011, 11:32:22 PM
WOW !!!   I've never been satisfied by a red light.

Maybe my color deficiency has held me back.

FREUD
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 06, 2011, 09:24:57 AM
For those that think Max is just sitting around... well he has been...  :-D  but he is sitting around unwrapping candy apple powdercoated parts. 

Well he has been a little busy, the cockpit is going back together.  Here are some peeks...
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 06, 2011, 09:41:16 AM
Max has gone just about powdercoat crazy... all the parts that were anodized years ago were scratched and faded.  He got tired of brushing rust and "canodizing" parts.... here's the reassembled rear wheel with a NOS 700 x 18 Firestone.... fresh from Art Arfons record attempts through Al Teague.  OK, maybe not brand new but it still looks new.  Should be good for 600...

Stopping is of course handled by the parachutes, but new brakes... or I should say brake was required, the old one fell victim to the salt

Max is planning to have the chassis all reassembled this week so he can start on the motors. 
One more thing, all the latches, actuators and safety related chunks will be coated yellow, making it easier for the safety crew that hopefully will never be needed.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Tman on June 06, 2011, 10:13:53 AM
Looks nice. I like the idea of the contrasting colors for latches. Learn something every day. Trent
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on June 07, 2011, 08:19:37 PM
.... here's the reassembled rear wheel with a NOS 700 x 18 Firestone.... fresh from Art Arfons record attempts through Al Teague.  OK, maybe not brand new but it still looks new.  Should be good for 600...


Got an e-mail yesterday from Drew, who will be one of the tech officials for the upcoming Bub Meet.  It seems that there may be an issue with the Firestone rear tire due to it's age, not it's condition, or it's capability.  Drew gave me a heads up, saying that there are LSR tires available.  It sounded to me that he was giving me time to make the change.  This is of great concern in order for the Vincent streamliner to run the Bub Meet.  This tire is capable of 400+mph speeds without any problem even though it's forty years old.  My liner is an extremely small package.  Any tire change would require extensive modifications, not only in the frame, but in the body.  It is impossible for me to make these changes before the Bub Meet. 

I know at age 72, I would never make the changes, but would just have to shelve the bike.  That's a lot to ask after 22 years of working on this project, which I started in 1989.  If the tire situation isn't resolved quickly, I'll be forced to pull my entry fee from the Bub Meet and attend the WOS.  Last year at the Bub Meet and at the WOS there was no trouble with running the 40 yr. old Firestone.  This year it's 41 years old and it seems to be a problem.  What's going on?

BTW three years ago unofficially that tire went 275 mph.  Last year we set the SCTA side car record at 191 mph.  Fastest recorded speed last year was 205 mph with no problem whatsoever.

                               Max

Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: SPARKY on June 08, 2011, 12:04:13 AM
What is the Diameter? will a M/T 26" work?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: gmax137 on June 08, 2011, 07:09:08 AM
Max, is there something in the rulebook about tire age?  Or is it just up to the tech inspector's judgment?
Gregg
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on June 08, 2011, 07:56:59 AM

What size rim is the M/T 26"?
Max  they are 18" (sparky)

I'll have to tell you Sparky, this tire situation is very upseting.  I've been around racing a long time and the tire that I have on the back of the liner is capable of speeds far greater than my bike will attain.  And furthermore, it's as good as a new M/T, probably better.  Everyone should know that if I thought for one minute that that tire was a safety issue, I wouldn't run the motorcycle.  My riders, Hartmut and Don are my long time friends.  I've known both of them for years.  In the case of Don Angel, 50 years.  There's no way I would endanger the lives of these two men.   

                             Max
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on June 08, 2011, 08:04:35 AM

I've never been able to find anything in any of the rule books which stipulates the age of a tire,  and says that if this age is exceeded it is no longer acceptable.  It just isn't in the rule books.

I answered Drew's e-mail first.  He didn't reply so I called him last night.  Left a message.  Hopefully he'll get back to me today.  Hartmut Weidelich, who was scheduled to ride the Bub Meet, notified me that if the Bub Meet is off, due to the tire situation, he won't be able to attend the World of Speed, or any other meet this year.  What a bummer.

                                 Max
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: 38flattie on June 08, 2011, 08:52:41 AM
Max, I hope you can get the tire situation resolved quickly!

That's a beautiful build, and it would be a shame if it didn't run because of a tire.

Good luck.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on June 08, 2011, 10:53:54 AM
 :cheers: :-D

YippyYippyYea!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just got through talking to Drew.  I don't know if offering him a steak dinner had anything to do with it, but the Firestone is a go for the Bub Meet. 

The steak thing is a joke of course.

                     See ya at Bub,

                             Max

                       
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: 38flattie on June 08, 2011, 02:19:59 PM
Congrats! That's awesome news! :cheers:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: AHG on June 08, 2011, 02:50:20 PM
"The steak thing is a joke of course."
Maybe to you it is, but don't surprised when I show up around dinner time!!
...and, apple pie with some ice cream on top I definitely won't refuse. :roll:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: nrhs sales on June 08, 2011, 03:46:57 PM
After you hit up Max you need to go see Santa and get some cheese to drizzle on top of the steak!!
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on June 09, 2011, 12:24:50 PM
 :-DGreat news ....Dad you buy the steak and I`ll Pitch in for the pie. :-D
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Luckyontheducky on June 10, 2011, 09:11:30 AM
Are there any special steps to keeping a tire viable for 40 years?  Daily massages and oil rubdowns?  Cool & dark enviroments or what?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: joea on June 10, 2011, 10:41:21 AM
..and what does the manufacturer say or recommend for running 40 yr
old tires near their rated speed ie..400 mph..?..they might have some good
engineering feedback that all of us could learn from..

go getem Max..really hoping to see runs over 300..

Joe :)
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Moxnix on June 10, 2011, 11:33:55 AM
Store in a bag after dressing them with pure carnuba wax.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: panic on June 10, 2011, 12:07:58 PM
X2: protect against UV and ozone. If you can, light air pressure in the bag also delays gas-out of the lighter petro-chems.

A tire 40 years old may still be structurally what it was (cord and bead), but certainly the exterior skin is chemically different.
The hydrocarbons are volatile, and the sulfur oxidizes. How fast petros migrate out to the exterior, IDK. There's probably some difference between brands and intended use (mileage vs. traction) but a new tire should be entirely homogeneous.

I'll bet that a Goodyear/Dunlop person could tell an unsafe tire from a spectroscopic analysis. Just compare a 1mm deep punch biopsy against new for % petro and sulfur.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 13, 2011, 06:23:06 PM
Luckily the old Fearstones were made when rubber was really rubber.... same tire was capable of 600 40 years ago so we are all glad the tire is not going to be an issue with the scooter.

Snuck by Max's and took a couple of fotos....
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 13, 2011, 06:25:16 PM
looks like progress... must have gotten carried away with the yellow, got some on the front suspension...  :-D
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 19, 2011, 11:02:57 PM
OK, it isn't really suspension, it is the steering link.  But it is really hard to see how much salt is packed in around the area, Max hope the yellow helps improve the visual.

So here is a little of what Max has been doing, the cockpit safety items.

The dash and new electronic tach

The external actuation fire bottles.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Luckyontheducky on June 20, 2011, 09:24:12 AM
Looks GREAT, Bob!

What happened to the water pump switches?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: SPARKY on June 20, 2011, 09:33:40 AM
Woooo  :-) thats purdy  8-)

water pump switches best left to outsiders---ie the guy who closes the canopy from our experience!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on June 20, 2011, 10:43:16 AM


For 2011, much of the wiring harness has been replaced.  I eliminated all water switches that were located on the dash in the cockpit area.  The water switch is now turned on externally.  A single switch powers the two water pumps that provide water circulation through the cylinder muffs. 

              Thanks for the kudos,
                         Max

     
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TURK on June 20, 2011, 09:14:37 PM
Max: Where did you get the Tach/---Turk
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 20, 2011, 11:12:11 PM
Remember the pile of parts a few posts back.... it is getting smaller

The pipes have new wrap

But there is another pile of parts just back from paint.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 20, 2011, 11:31:10 PM
Lets see, where did that pesky water switch go... oh yeah, back next to the master shutoff and external fire extinguisher, those are yellow, flash must have washed them out.

Max changed the rear brake disk and caliper.  The old caliper and cast disk was traded for this Nascar type set.

And a new master... old one was leaking through the corrosion...
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: bvillercr on June 20, 2011, 11:32:54 PM
Looking great, are you running BUB?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Peter Jack on June 21, 2011, 01:46:41 AM
Careful you don't test those safety toes!!! :evil: :evil: :evil:

Pete
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: MattGuzzetta on June 22, 2011, 02:04:47 AM
That is an interesting steering linkage.  Is it similar to the setup that Don Vesco had on the motorcycle version of the liner? :?  He used a setup to prevent bump steer when steering into the wind at the cut in the mountains, that used to create some bad wobbles at speed.
That is one great looking vehicle :-D I hope it goes as well as it looks, should run some big numbers.

Matt Guzzetta
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on June 22, 2011, 07:22:01 PM
Max: Where did you get the Tach/---Turk

Turk doesn't have to worry about where I got the tach.  Those digital tachs that clip onto a sparkplug wire are very reasonable in price.  I bought two of them.  Turk dropped by the house got all the info on where to buy one.  I loaned him my spare as he'll be doing some testing this weekend on his bike that he'll be running at Bub.

Good luck Turk.  I hope your testing goes well.

                             Max
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on June 22, 2011, 07:24:39 PM
Looking great, are you running BUB?

Yep.  We'll be running Bub.  The bike will have a wheel on a stick for this year's runs. 

                               Thanks,
                                  Max
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on June 22, 2011, 07:30:08 PM
That is an interesting steering linkage.  Is it similar to the setup that Don Vesco had on the motorcycle version of the liner? :?  He used a setup to prevent bump steer when steering into the wind at the cut in the mountains, that used to create some bad wobbles at speed.
That is one great looking vehicle :-D I hope it goes as well as it looks, should run some big numbers.

Matt Guzzetta

Actually Matt, Don Vesco was my mentor when I first started this project some 22 years ago.  The steering is of his design.  Sure miss that guy.

                                 Max
P.S.
Don Vesco was the first one to take a ride in the Vincent streamliner.  The year was 1996. 
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: MattGuzzetta on June 22, 2011, 09:26:46 PM
 :-D Thanks for the quick reply and the information.  I was lucky to be Don's partner in Don Vesco Products and the Zero bump steer system was designed to eliminate the wobbling problem caused by counter steering into the wind at speed, the suspension moves and you get the wobble.  You can eliminate the bump steer when going straight, but when you steer, all bets are off..... . The patent #4,610,461 shows a variety of ways to use the system and if anyone is interested in getting complete control of wheel steering in all of the suspension envelope, you are welcome to use the info.  It does require some special u-joint-bearing interfaces, but that is nothing for this crowd.   Glad to see that it is being used to make your ride safer! 

Again, beautiful liner! :cheers: 
Matt Guzzetta
 
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: 4-barrel Mike on June 23, 2011, 12:18:28 AM
Interesting!

"A steering and suspension mechanism for a wheeled vehicle incorporating bump steer control. The mechanism comprises a pair of spaced apart universal joints one of which is fixedly located and the other positionably supporting the wheel axle. A spacer member positions the universal joints at a...

Inventor: Matthew Guzzetta
Primary Examiners: Everett G. Diederiks, Jr."

http://www.google.com/patents?id=R0Q2AAAAEBAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=4,610,461&hl=en&ei=h70CTsHWHYrUtQPawvSVBA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCkQ6AEwAA (http://www.google.com/patents?id=R0Q2AAAAEBAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=4,610,461&hl=en&ei=h70CTsHWHYrUtQPawvSVBA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCkQ6AEwAA)

Mike
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on June 26, 2011, 05:19:43 PM
 :wink:

Things moving along pretty good this past week.  A lotta stuff bolted on to the frame.  Maybe we kin get Stainless over hear in a day or two and talk him into taking some pics to get on this thread, so those interested can take a looksee as to what's going on here in Wichita. 

As you probably all know Stainless is occupied right now with the build of a pretty fantastic shop.

                                     Max


Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TURK on June 28, 2011, 05:35:54 PM
Greetings Group: I just took my grandson Andy over to show him Max's streamliner,he was well impressed to say the least. Max ever gracious gave Andy a Black Lightening tee shirt,he was thrilled. Progress is moving right along on the liner. Looks like the Black Lightening will be "BLACK" again.  Group let me tell you Max has outdone all previous attempts,this thing is gorgeous,never better. Workmanship and finish is not to be excelled by any other. This should be "the year"for MAD Max, president of the F.O.F.F. club for those of you who don't know and how could you, I just started it. That stands for "Fast Old Farts Forever"---See ya on the salt----Turk
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on June 29, 2011, 08:07:44 AM
Turk, I agree the streamliner looks magnificant. The build is going real well. I can't wait for stainless to download some more photos so you all can see what we are talking about. It's definately Back in Black!
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 29, 2011, 11:26:15 PM
Some of you may remember way back when the black lightning was black.  Here if your sneak preview of the body work for this years attempt.

I will try to post some of the technical parts tomorrow... being a framers helper is wearing my ass out  :-o but I almost have a roof over the shop again
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Peter Jack on June 30, 2011, 03:03:36 AM
The smile is well deserved Max. Your liner is going to look AWSOME this year. Good Luck!  :-D :-D :-D

Pete
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: sabat on June 30, 2011, 08:40:40 AM
Nice!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on June 30, 2011, 10:12:45 AM
Stainless could you take a few pics of the motor breakdown and buildup for my video I'm doing.             Thanks Max.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 30, 2011, 10:44:20 PM
Stainless could you take a few pics of the motor breakdown and buildup for my video I'm doing.             Thanks Max.

Sure Max Jr, of course your dad will have to start working on the motors first... OK, they have their heads off, but I know he will be starting the total redo soon.
 
In the mean time... here's a little more, first we look at the fire system and the C02 system.   The black bottle on top is the C02, it used to have the regulator, gauges and fill port hose up with bottle.  It was plagued with constant leaks from the fill port and bottle shutoff.   
The fire bottles have be refurbished and inspected with the info easy to see from the top so Drew won't get eye strain trying to see them with a mirror.

Here is where the Halon fogs the motor area... follow the magic fingers... not the toes... Max sure likes the carpet in the garage.

Here is the new location for the C02 regulator and fill port, nestled between the Fuel tank and the not yet installed oil tank.

Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on June 30, 2011, 11:07:18 PM
In this first one we have the ignition system battery and the externally actuated fire systems. 

Here is the "motors eye view" of the externally actuated bottles, the motor bottle on the right at the end of the finger.  The riders bottle discharges into the braided hose that takes it up front.

From the other side we see the water tank has been installed and the water hoses to the "muffs" have been routed and secured.  The back tire, brake and fender is waiting on someone to help Max bleed the brakes, then they are ready.  We also see the water pumps, pump battery and the parachute solenoid.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 01, 2011, 07:49:50 AM
Couldn't get in to take a riders view  :roll: , but here is what Hartmut and Donny see after the handlebars are locked down and before the canopy is lowered, all that is left in the cockpit is to put the windscreen on. 
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 12, 2011, 08:29:58 AM
WOW... WOW... WOW  :-o
The front of the bike is done, new windscreen, fresh black paint
It looks really great for a race bike, looking more like a museum quality restoration.... Max says he is not changing the bike design again so everything is getting a good paint and finish to protect against the salt
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 12, 2011, 08:41:16 AM
The Transmission is in after a full disassembly, gears look new, bearings now also look new... Max uses 2nd, 3rd and 4th in this custom case "rock crusher" Muncie

Yes the chain is also new and the alignment is done, this end is ready to race... 'cept for body, the bottom half is being modified to be able to leave the sidecar on for all service, cutting down on turn around time.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 12, 2011, 08:55:34 AM
Here's a couple of the shifter and linkage... the air cylinder does the work, the linkage still needs the electrical sequence switch attached. 
It may still look very crowded in there, but actually Max has a big box of stuff that is not getting used... several water tanks and pumps.  He decided the clutch should not be water cooled, last year the water and oil mix after a seal leaked let it slip.  A hot iron clutch should burn a little oil without the help of water to spread it around.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 12, 2011, 09:09:24 AM
The drive sprocket cover has a carrier bearing to support the load on the output shaft.  630 race chain will use BG Chain lube.

The side car frame is attached, I suspect the duct tape tire will not make a run...

The staging table... easier than picking them out of the pile on the floor...  most of these covers, brackets and braces go on the motor... Oops, the front is not ready to run, Max needs to install the new steering dampener, the old one was sliding too easily, the adjustments frozen by exposure to you know what....  :roll:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 12, 2011, 09:28:08 AM
Max says the easy part is next on the to do list...


More to come when I can get over there.  Seems like Max is working faster than usual, but actually he is working at his regular steady pace, just the pictures are farther apart due to a little construction I have been doing at my house.  The outside of the shop is finally closed in.  BTW, consturction is not recommended as an old man's sport.... my knee is killing me from so many trips up the ladder and most of the cuts and slices from working the metal roof are starting to heal...  :|
 :cheers:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: sabat on July 12, 2011, 10:17:12 AM
Thanks for the great pics and updates  :cheers:

Nice looking construction work! 
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Freud on July 12, 2011, 11:53:10 AM
Will that type construction survive tornados?

FREUD
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 12, 2011, 11:51:48 PM
Our hope is the bike will survive 300 MPH winds (speed generated) on the salt....  :-D

and that we never find out if the shop will live through a tornado... 
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Speed Limit 1000 on July 13, 2011, 12:46:19 AM
How is the motor for the Bockscar? Are we going to install it this weekend?  :cheers:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Ron Gibson on July 13, 2011, 08:39:42 AM
Looking good, Stainless. Way better than last time I saw it.
You won't know what to do with all the extra room, weeellll after seeing all your STUFF, you will know what to do with it, but then again, maybe there won't be any extra room. LOL

Ron
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: SPARKY on July 13, 2011, 10:17:57 AM
has your wife given you a performance deadline :-o  and that is your "Golden Parachute" saftey net to keep you from becoming a homeless old lsr racer???
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 15, 2011, 12:48:50 AM
Well it is about 900 SF and I get almost 600 of it, the remaining part keeps me living in the house with he deck I stood on to take the pics....  :-o but this is the scooter thread and Max is progressing. 
I went by and helped Max put the motors on the bench so he could work on them a little easier.  Sorry no pictures of anything new, but there will be more in a week.... or so
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on July 20, 2011, 02:43:09 PM
 Right now they have 11 miles of dry salt,Yea!!!
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 31, 2011, 09:45:57 PM
And now back to the real building project....

Max is working on the motors, the frame and the peripherals are done for the most part, well maybe a few loose ends and a little body work and paint

so on to the motors... this the case half that ties the 2 motors together.  Two years ago when the chain broke and busted these cases Max pressed it back together and welded it up.  Some cracks came back... sooooo Max cleaned it all up, ground out the welds and the patch welds, lined it all back up and then got it welded.  The guy did a fine job without warping everything.

These are some of the cracked spots that were rewelded
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 31, 2011, 10:03:38 PM
Warpage is important because this case mounts to that one, and you see that BIG seal?  That is one of the clutch seals, and of course it is modified, cutting the metal cup thinner. so the alignment is critical.

Last one is a few more parts back from powdercoat... the jugs are now ready, the case covers are ready, and soon the repaired case will also be black and ready for assembly.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 31, 2011, 10:25:45 PM
Let's look at the clutch a little...
Last year the seal that goes in the middle popped loose, leaked oil on the plates and mixed with the cooling water to caused slippage.  This year it gets a high temp seal and no cooling water.  This bottom plate will be dimpled to reduce the contact area and hopefully some of the heat transfer to the basket and seal.

Last year between the Bub and WoS Max modified the clutch for an additional plate. 

But the really big news on the clutch is the pressure plate.  The one on the right is the old aluminum one.  Sometimes it warped under engagement pressure and heat, making adjustment and consistency difficult.  The new one on the right is steel.  Max hopes it will make the clutch a little more manageable.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 31, 2011, 10:43:58 PM
Remember the bodywork I mentioned a few posts back?  Max is paving over the skids since they are not required with the sidecar.  The other goal in body mods is being able to remove the bottom half without removing the hack.  It takes a lot time and makes between round service harder to complete in the prescribed turn around time. 

And this is Mike Shea, from Maryland, Mike flew in to help Max get the liner ready for this year.   OK, you will have a hard time recognizing him when you see him on the salt, I'll get a shot with his face in it sometime.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on July 31, 2011, 10:56:52 PM
Mike just emailed this picture, Max is fitting up the cases with a little epoxy to ensure a good flat seal surface between the two cases. He has always done this on this area, puts a skim of epoxy on one side, parting agent on the other... a little squish.... and we have a good sealing surface.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on August 03, 2011, 09:03:38 AM
Motor is going together...
here's one of the new oil pumps and part of the old one.  The 2 pieces on the left make the new single start oil pump... for the last several years Max has been using a double start drive (right) but they wear quickly because they run at double speed.  The oil mods last year worked great, so Max switched back to single start.  If you look carefully, you can see the second start on the piece on the right.

For those that think Max just sits around and admires his work here is proof that sometimes he stands around...  OK just kidding, Max is getting the motors together

And again you see Mike working in the background... I would take a front shot but it would violate his witness protection agreement  :roll:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: octane on August 03, 2011, 09:08:17 AM
Best of luck Max !

The highlight of BUB
is hearing this magnificent machine start up !
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on August 03, 2011, 09:11:47 AM
My Grandson Trey helping out.... wait a minute... we don't text around here...

Uh Oh... now I've done it... if you see Mike on the salt, stop and say hi, he has been Max's biggest helper this year.  Not to worry, WP always relocates folks that pop out  :roll:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Stainless1 on August 03, 2011, 09:22:15 AM
The high temp seal is in, brown rubber instead of black

And the dimpled plate... Dimples will be face down on the basket reducing the contact patch and hopefully reducing clutch heat transfer to the basket and seal.

Sidecar getting a little touch-up as well.  It had a few stress cracks, so Max reinforced it with angle riveted in and then added a little blending.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: bak189 on August 03, 2011, 10:45:35 AM
All that sealing compound is a No No.....after all it is British made and needs to leak oil...Sorry...........

Best of luck Max and crew for 2011...........remember, there are again dollars waiting for the fastest
sidecar streamliner
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on August 15, 2011, 12:32:06 PM
Mad Max has the motors together and if all goes well we should be starting them up today.We have a little body work to do but the sound of those vincent motors on song makes my eyes water,or maybe it`s the alcohal.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: nrhs sales on August 15, 2011, 01:27:33 PM
I really thik you should paint it black and gold again like you hadf a few years ago.  Much more Vincent like.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on August 18, 2011, 08:40:23 AM
Just a quick update. 

I finished putting the engines in the frame and hooking everything up this last Saturday.  The bike has undergone a complete rebuild for the 2011 Bub Meet.  All systems work very well.  During start up only found one oil leak.  That's been fixed.  Will pick up the painted body parts tomorrow.  Black Lightning is back to black this year.  She looks racy and a bit menacing.  Will be spending the day going through spares and procuring consumables.

                                       Max
   
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: nrhs sales on August 18, 2011, 10:52:18 AM
I must be psychic!!! :-o
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 19, 2011, 01:51:53 AM
Hey Max, thanks for all of your time and energy to give it another shot this year, I know it gets harder on you each year. See you soon on the salt at BUB.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on August 19, 2011, 07:18:39 PM
Since Stainless Is on his way home from Speed Week and a new record under his belt,I thought I try to upload Some Photos of Dads Progress.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on August 19, 2011, 07:22:08 PM
Preparing to load the motor in the frame.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on August 19, 2011, 07:30:23 PM
Ready to Install the motor.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on August 20, 2011, 10:13:41 AM
We need Stainless back to help with .the dialog,Heres a view of the transmission,water lines to the heads are in the rear view.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Tman on August 20, 2011, 11:13:32 AM
Looks good, thanks!

Stainless must have fixed the broken axle?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on August 21, 2011, 01:18:28 PM
Here`s some more pics.Enjoy
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on August 21, 2011, 01:25:52 PM
Only an X Navy man can put ten pounds of shit in a five pound bag,I`m still amazed how much thought ,trial and effort has went into the Lambky`s Liner.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: little max on August 21, 2011, 01:42:13 PM
Dads is getting the body work back today ,went to go look at the body parts yesterday and he was pleased with the job and if you know Max It has to be done with top quality or it wont go on the Liner.The decals are laying on the dinner table just waiting on a permanent home.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Luckyontheducky on August 22, 2011, 10:12:51 AM
DANG!  Thats gonna' be one good lookin' machine inside and out! 
Once again, economic forces have conspired to keep me at home this year but I will certainly be there in spirit and hitting the 'refresh' button on the website for updates.

go get em' Team Max!
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on August 24, 2011, 01:34:16 PM
 :-P

It's done.  We're outta here.  See you on the salt!

                      Yours for the LSR,

                              Mad Max

                     The Kansas Bad Man
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Kansas Bad Man on August 24, 2011, 01:41:47 PM

Hey Slim and Rat, drop by the Black Lightning pit at the Bub Meet, I've got something for you guys.

                                  Max
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Seldom Seen Slim on August 24, 2011, 02:05:04 PM
Economic forces will keep Nancy and me from attending Bub's, so please allow Ray to receive the (whatever it is).  Thanks, and best wishes for a safe and fast event.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 29, 2011, 06:16:23 PM
Max's salt trailer chauffeur here.

After our aptly named shake down run (due to the rough salt) on Sunday, we spent yesterday and today making various tweaks, hunting down oil leaks, finding loose fasteners, converting the rigid front end back to suspension, replaced the push rod tubes, and adjusted the blower belt alignment. We should be in line to run in the morning.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: GuitarSlinger on August 29, 2011, 07:59:45 PM
To the Kansas Bad Man from your neighbor over here KC way ,  GuitarSlinger .

Keep the rubber side down and lets see that Vincent ride to some big numbers .

PS the RedRyder knows who I am
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Vinsky on August 29, 2011, 09:05:38 PM
Max,
This has got to be the year. I'd give anyting to be there helping and celebrating.

John
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: sabat on August 29, 2011, 10:28:09 PM
Best of luck folks  :cheers:
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 30, 2011, 01:17:36 PM
Wrenching is done, just about to fire up the motors in the pit.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 30, 2011, 01:23:44 PM
Sounded good, now it's time to adjust the clutch.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 30, 2011, 02:50:56 PM
We are heading to the start line
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 30, 2011, 03:56:55 PM
Hartmut is suiting up...
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 30, 2011, 04:45:19 PM
143 MPH, still running lean after the last adjustment to richen it up, but Hartmut says it is a much smoother ride with the front suspension back in place. Changing the fuel mixture, and working fast to get back out there.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 30, 2011, 08:28:11 PM
Staged, but missed the cutoff so we will be in line first thing in the morning.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 31, 2011, 11:17:17 AM
Liner has been unloaded at the start line, but we are waiting on the wind.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: landracing on August 31, 2011, 11:31:56 AM
you got three wheels, who cares about wind?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Glen on August 31, 2011, 11:54:31 AM
What kind of statement is that
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on August 31, 2011, 12:53:49 PM
We can tolerate more wind than the solo liners, but ours can still get blown off course.

152 point something, still dialing in the fuel mixture, all other systems are working fine.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Tzoom on August 31, 2011, 02:24:42 PM
Thanks for keeping us updated.  The BUB site is useless.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: dw230 on August 31, 2011, 03:08:20 PM
How can someone named landracing with one post be an administrator?

Stupid statement.

DW
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Seldom Seen Slim on August 31, 2011, 03:11:32 PM
I looked into that one post thing, Dan.  In the members section it says the poster signed up in December and this is the only post.  I have to think that something's gone to hell in a handbasket with Jon's user id.  I don't find any other login for him, though -- so will wait for further information.  I deleted his account by accident a while ago - don't want to do that again. :-(
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Luckyontheducky on August 31, 2011, 03:13:03 PM
Thanks for keeping us updated.  The BUB site is useless.

Also look in "BUB 2011" in BUB General Chat on the Landracing.com forum homepage.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Tzoom on August 31, 2011, 07:19:22 PM
Guess I should have scrolled down a little farther.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: ironsclad on September 01, 2011, 10:23:02 AM
Anything further on the Black Lightning today?
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on September 01, 2011, 12:22:47 PM
We are at the start line waiting for a lull in the wind.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on September 01, 2011, 01:58:34 PM
Lost the front motor, burned a piston.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: sabat on September 01, 2011, 02:52:19 PM
Argh.  :-(
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: Luckyontheducky on September 01, 2011, 03:19:27 PM
Was it going fast?!
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: tomsmith on September 01, 2011, 04:37:19 PM
Disconnect the front motor and run on the rear one.  The Johnson (& Dudek?) 650cc pushrod Triumph liner did 230mph in the 50s with about 65 HP.  Marty Dickerson did about 150mph on his sit-on non-streamlined gas Vincent also in the 1950s.  You should get the record on just the rear motor.  I wanna see it run - don't give up.
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: saltwheels262 on September 01, 2011, 04:47:17 PM
Lost the front motor, burned a piston.

dag nagget.

can it run with the rear engine only?

franey
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: hotrod on September 01, 2011, 06:35:29 PM
Bummer -- do you have the parts to do a field repair, or is that motor done for the meet?

Larry
Title: Re: Black Lightning 2011 attempt
Post by: TouringComet on September 01, 2011, 07:17:42 PM
We had another piston but since this is the last day of the meet and it closes early, there was no time for repairs.

Max has an AMA record as a solo streamliner and an SCTA record as a sidecar streamliner, but at speeds that should be much higher, and since his original goal was the 322 EasyRiders speed, running on one engine wouldn't be considered, whether or not it would be mechanically feasible.

Thanks for your interest and support.

Who knows, Max may try again next year.