Landracing Forum
East Coast Timing Association => ECTA General Chat => Topic started by: KeithTurk on July 11, 2009, 06:09:29 AM
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Talked to the folks at the Cape again and they simply say we have spectators and that isn't a "Good Fit"
So basically they told me "NO" several times in several different ways... ( I kept asking and skewing the question to see what the actual issue was )
It all comes down to securing the secrecy of our facility that is going to in in dis-use in the coming years...
BUMMER...
Keith
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Did I read somewhere (maybe here) that there is an alternate shuttle strip in texas just north of waco? I cant say for sure, but thought i had heard that somewhere....
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What if this event didn't have spectators (racers and crews only), kind of like a "secret" race ?
:?
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one crew, one car... 10 folks.... all under guard... hmmm
Waco... didn't they host the ATF for a while?
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one crew, one car... 10 folks.... all under guard... hmmm
OK, OK.
So, in reality the answer is just plain flat NO with the reason being security of an obsolete, defunct facility, rather than all the bullsh!t reasons they stated to get rid of you ?
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Steve, shshh ! it's a secret !!!
We do not have spectators, we have drivers, crews, and team members and Family..
The $5.00 at the gate is not an admission fee, it is to purchase that weekends
"Commemorative Bracelet"
Charles
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I invoke the CRS amendment on this , I don't remember the sequence of events here, But...
About the time I first researched alternative LSR venues, I read about this facility, and supposedly NASA was looking for some group to utilize it. I checked it out via Google Earth or similar, thought it looked great, and called Tim Suddard at GrassRootsMotorsports as his HQ is relatively nearby in Florida to sic him on it for a possible multi use Motorsports complex, LSR top of the list, Thank You.
Apparently they got the same response, so maybe you need Mike Cook or some FL politico knows how to bring stimuli $ out there ?
Would be neat in mid winter to have this place, though.
Bob W , LTA, 1700 miles North of The Cape
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I would drive down there in Nov-March if they had an event or 3 !!!!
Charles
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Is there anyone in Congress who has a past or present interest in motorsports?
I would be surprised if anyone you reach at NASA could actually make a decision. Normally they are adminstrators, and are always going to take the easiest route for themselves. If they are given a task to complete by outside directive, then they would do it.
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Try Longview TX
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what's in Longview?
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With Dulles having opened a 4th runway last year and a fifth in the works it sure would be nice to shut down one of the originals, preferably the one by the Steven F. Udvar-Hazy Center (Air & Space Museum), for an annual land speed event. I have already heard rumours of an unnofficial 'event' possibly taking place there in August so someone in the FAA has an interest, or blind eye, to the sport. if you could match that person up with someone from the Smithsonian who knows what could happen? Just a thought anyways. I may get an invite to the unofficial event. If so, maybe I will get a feel for the potential. I think the runway nearest to the museum is 11,500 ft. They also run some kind of annual plane pull event on airport property I believe but not sure what space that occupies.
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An airport that shows up on google satalite photo---but the James Connaly in Waco might be a better opportunity now that Bush is no longer Pres---thear where A Force 1 used to land...
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I am thinking our calendar is pretty full now on the east coast with the exception of the winter months where Florida is probably the only option we could be confident in. A friend at work was looking at an official base closing schedule the other day. Maybe there is something else down there we are missing. Daytona, where it all began, has a 10,500 runway but I doubt it could be shut down.
As far as the rest of the year, even though it is only 5 weekends, we definitely have a positive impact on the economy in the Maxton area. I sort of get the feeling the airport community prefers to ignore us but the lodging and food industry sure doesn't mind our presence. The real joy of participating in this sport is that all the participants gather at one location and we build friendships. Even though those in the far north and south have to travel a long ways to events, it would be a shame to have competing events in the same month that would split the ranks. That said a one-time demonstration in the Capital area at Dulles, or maybe Andrews Air Force Base if possible, would be very cool.
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Well, now that I think about it -- maybe I'll see if we could get the local police and sheriff and state police to close down one road in this area for us to use. Here's the story:
In south Marquette there's the old K I Sawyer AFB, where Buffs and tankers and other planes lived, and the runway is now used as Marquette County Int'l Airport. So that nice 14,500 foot place ain't for us. But -- back in the day when the airplanes were just first arriving hereabouts, the powers that were decided that County Road 550, headed north from Marquette to Big Bay (I'm giving you the locations so you can search online for the stretch of road) might make a passable emergency landing strip. So -- the road is twisty and turning and all that -- save to one really nice flat straight stretch a couple of miles long. It's something like 15 or twenty miles north of the city of Marquette.
Up 'til this year 550 has been the only road to Big Bay other than a gravel C R 510 -- but there's a nickle mine being built up there, and that mine will need improved roads for hauling, so the improved one might be an acceptable alternate for when we've got 550 closed for racing. Said straight stretch has long been used by local folks to "blow the carbon out of the engine" in their vehicles (not that I'd even have done such a nefarious deed), to the point that cops hang out there to ticket fast moving vehicles when the students at the college (for example) fel the need to stretch the legs of their vehicles.
Scope it out on your Google earth or whatever devices and let me know if it's time for me to start calling in all of the nice things I've done over these past thirty-five years up here.
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SSS, sounds cool,,,, one small issue on a public road, even if all would work and they closed the road.. we would have to have parking/pit areas...
Also on big safety concern, I would scope out the close proximity of any trees, telephone or power poles on either side of the road / racing and shut down surfaces...Hitting a cone or some tall grass, weeds or crops may be bad,,, but a tree, power or telephone pole could render a bad day for all.
Charles
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Yes, Charles -- all of those obstacles are available on CR 550. I'ts been a handful of years since I've driven up there and I don't remember just how close is the forest. There aren't any houses along the stretch. There are probably large flat areas where pits could be located. It's only been ten or fifteen years since electricity was run up the road to Big Bay, so the power lines are not too close to the road (old fashioned lines were on smaller poles and right on the right-of-way).
I'll zoom up there with a camera, just for the heck of it, and let us all see what it looks like. I aagree that it's probably not an ideal place for LSR -- but maybe it's worth a look, and for sure is worth a ride to see.
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You're wasting your time trying to call anybody at The Cape. You need to try somebody in Washington who can actual make a decision. Bill Nelson is about the highest ranking Washington politician who's area includes KSC and he's been up on the Shuttle. You should be able to find him on line. He has an office here in Jacksonville.
3 miles of concrete with nobody around except the alligators and the snakes would be perfect.
I've been to KSC enough to know that unless you find a way to put a spin on this that will result in more tax dollars for the space program, that you would be swimming upstream on this one.
The biggest reason they will probably never allow this is because of all the other rocket launches that most people don't even know about. Whenever they launch anything, no one is allowed near for obvious safety reasons.
http://www.nasa.gov/missions/highlights/schedule.html
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I would like to add that if you do manage to pull this off, you have a new problem that you don't have anywhere else. KSC sits right in the middle of the Merritt Island National Wildlife Refuge. I would estimate it is 90% swamp and they have a LOT of alligators and snakes. If someone runs off the side of the runway and into the swamp, who is going to wade out to get them?
Years ago on Alligator Alley (I-75 across the Everglades between Miami and Ft Myers), I saw a tractor trailer who's driver had fallen asleep at the wheel and run off the side into the swamp. He was in water almost to the bottom of the driver's window. He wasn't getting out and the fire department wasn't going in to get him either. They were waiting for a boat to run a chain from the wrecker to the trailer so they could drag him out backwards.
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Keep an eye on Cecil field. I believe there was 14,000 feet of beautiful runway there when the Navy said bye bye. At some point the Navy and Virginia Beach are going to part ways. That would open 17,000 feet of runway at Oceana.
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My understanding is that the Navy recommitted to Oceana after the planned move of the F-18 squadrons to Cecil was defeated. It was one or the other or spend billions to build a new airbase for them. The Navy needed Virginia Beach to limit encroachment around the base and I think that has happened, probably due to the economy as much as anything else.
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I just wanted everyone to know we tried real hard and they told us NO... politely.. but No all the same...
K
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The former Wurthsmuth AFB runway at Oscoda, Mi. is currently being used for SCCA events. It is also being used by race teams for high speed testing on a fairly regular basis. SCCA is holding an Auto cross event there this weekend. The brother of a friend has a shop just off the runway. He said the cost is 1,000.00 per day which includes the fire rescue truck and crew. I had no reason to contact them but do have a contact number. Michigan Mile?? July weather is usually in the high 70,s.
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Now we are talking....The Michigan Mile.
2.25 miles of runway.....That is not 800 miles away. :-D
Seth