Landracing Forum
Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => Build Diaries => Topic started by: LIGGAN on October 10, 2008, 02:48:46 PM
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It's time to start my build..........o.k. maybe I should start over and say..........it's time to start again on my build....for the third time! I bought my studebaker when I was 15...had all the time...just no money....at 18 ....I had some money....did a mustang II front clip...then went braindead for the last 14 years. For some reason I could never bring myself to sell the car...I've owned it over half my life and have never driven it.(I know how sad and stupid that sounds) Anyways.....I'm alittle older...and hopefully alittle less stupid...and with the group of friends and family I have now....it's about time I get off my a$$ and get this thing started.
The plans as of now are...chopping the top (after seeing Hooley's stude)...so that buts me in competition coupe...One of my best friends owns a machine shop and after looking over an old rule book wants to build a 302 SBC....so it'll be in D/GCC. Here's a pic of the car as it sits as of yesterday.....hope'en to start the chop this weekend.....so I'll post more pics and updates as soon as I can.
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Hey Liggan, it looks like a good winter project to get started with. As you know you will lots of help on the web site. At least you are close to a bunch of good help and supplies down there in So Cal. Keep us up on the build.
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Cool, another Stude! We finally get to start on ours tomorrow - hopefully it'll run next year in D/CBGC, also with a 302 SBC (+turbo).
Maybe we can have parallel Stude build diaries through the winter.
Good luck!
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Liggan, looks good so far,Iam in Riverside too let me know if you need a hand going the chop, have a sheet metal shop we do lots of chops and custom metal work aka Kilgers Kustom Metal. We have a fuel roadster that we are building and a streamliner in the shop right now. (909-888-9045 Mike
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Hey, Liggen,
It IS about time (money, too). :-D
If the rest of the car is as straight as this appears to be, then half the battle is won.
Chop it low and make it go!
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:cheers:waiting to see
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Think long and hard before you chop the top on your stude. It is much more competitive in classic class as what the classic class was started up for. Check out the competition in cc. Can you imagine if one of the 300+ mph camero or firebirds with a few modification decided to run cc. If you don't have the full front clip it is available in fiber glass and would be legal. In classic class I have held the E blown gas record currently hold the D blown gas record for 5 years and have qualified on several occasion 4 mph over the C record. Again think long and hard you can always make changes to the engine size or make but its hard to unchopp the top. :-)
Bob Ragsdale
#745 - 200 MPH member
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Think long and hard before you chop the top on your stude. It is much more competitive in classic class as what the classic class was started up for. Check out the competition in cc. ................Again think long and hard you can always make changes to the engine size or make but its hard to unchopp the top. :-)
Bob Ragsdale
#745 - 200 MPH member
I agree if you want to be competitive in comp couple a stude is not what you want. We found a niche and jumped in there, but the niche is going away fast.
c ya,
Sum
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Mr. Ragsdale and Sumner.........thanks for the info.......But like your post said....you can't unchop a car..........it's already done.....I should say that its been started....The car really is more for myself and friends to have some fun......don't get me wrong.....a record will be the goal for El Mirage.......but we are lookin more towards the journey....like tonight.....havein afew beers,with all my buds, workin towards the goal.
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Bob, I thought in Classic the top could be chopped 3 inches ? I run Classic Gas Alt
E/CGALT with my 33 Ford Vicky (sedan) Is the chop allowed because it is a pre 1948 ?
I have not started work on my 53 Champion yet and will post pics soon...
I for sure want to run E/CGALT with the Stude too !
SUM, if in E/CGALT I can run a rear spolier how could I get cardboard templates of Hooley's rear spoilr/wing assembly ?
Thanks
Charles
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Cajun, I will jump in to this discussion. A chopped top on a 53 Stude puts you in comp coupe. I don't believe the spoiler on Hooley's stude would be legal in Altered Coupe. Check the rule book, and you will see what I mean. You need to decide whether you want to build one or the other. They are two very different animals, and don't innerbreed easily..................Bob
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2008 rulebook, page 64, paragraph two.
Only pre-1949 bodies may be chopped in the Altered classes.
DW
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DW,, thanks I thought it was 48 or 49 and back that can be chopped... That is why I was able to Run CGALT and still chop my 33 Ford 3 inches...
Hmm so to run my 53 Stude in CGALT I can not chop the top... oh well, at least as I read it I can modify/stregthen the frame/chassis/suspension...
That's what I will do..
Thanks for the clarification DW.
Charles
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........... I don't believe the spoiler on Hooley's stude would be legal in Altered Coupe. Check the rule book, and you will see what I mean. .....................Bob
I though that with an altered that a spoiler with spill plates was legal. Gary Hart runs one in AA/BGALT..
(http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/bville-cars-3/787-1-06.jpg)
......................... but is not running in "classic" if that makes a difference. In the altered section, page 64, it does say "A non-stock spoiler is permitted as defined in section 4.CC.6", but there again I get confused on how "classic" works.
Hey Bob how about sending me some pictures of your car, so I can add them to my site under....
http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/bville-cars-1/bville-all%20numbers.html
.......... thanks,
Sum
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As I understand it, in Classic the "altered rules" are the same as in any "altered" class...
Not sure, bit would sure like clarification before I start on any spoilers....
We now know Chopping a 53 is NOT allowed in Classic (only pre 1949's in Classic can be chopped a Max of 3 inch)
Charles
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I think Hart and Rgasdale both either or at least once ran in Classic Altered and both had side sills and spoilers ??
Charles
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Charles, its the size of the spoiler AND the spill plates that are limited in the modified catigory. Also, they are not legal in the gas coupe classes................read the book............Bob
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Maybe I need to clarify my earlier post. The spoilers are the same for Comp Coupe, Altered, and Classic Altered. I do not believe the spoiler on the 711 Stude is legal as shown on page 62 of the current rule book. I may be mistaken about Hooley's Stude. I keep looking at the side shot of the car with the crew behind it on Sum's website, and at first I thought the side spill plates were longer than allowed (beyond the centerline of the rear axle) but the more I look, the less sure I am. Damn Orange paint............
Sum, I will have to mail them to you, I ain't smart enough to download pictures on my computer.........or is that upload? Anyway, p.m. me your address...........Bob
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The danged (or perhaps I should say doggone) Politeness Police got me again.............. :-D
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Maybe I need to clarify my earlier post. The spoilers are the same for Comp Coupe, Altered, and Classic Altered. I do not believe the spoiler on the 711 Stude is legal as shown on page 62 of the current rule book. I may be mistaken about Hooley's Stude. I keep looking at the side shot of the car with the crew behind it on Sum's website, and at first I thought the side spill plates were longer than allowed (beyond the centerline of the rear axle) but the more I look, the less sure I am. blue jay Orange paint............
Sum, I will have to mail them to you, I ain't smart enough to download pictures on my computer.........or is that upload? Anyway, p.m. me your address...........Bob
Hi Bob, here is the address.........
http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/Site%20E-mail%20address.html
..................... and the spill plates don't go past the............
(http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/hooley/2006S-1.jpg)
......... center line. They end about the "t" or "i" in the purplesagetradingpost.com. It is hard to see, but what looks to be ahead of the center line is actually the body behind the rear window. Here is a little better picture....
(http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/hooley/2005-changes-24.jpg)
......... to maximize the CP they could have gone straight up at the centerline and straight down at the back
(http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/hooley/2005-changes-15.jpg)
..........., but Hooley got a little "artsy" in the production of them.
On the 761 (page 62 -- I think you had 711) they have multiple..........
(http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/bville-cars-3/761-3-06.jpg)
...................spill plates. The rule book doesn't seem to say how many you can have, but I don't see where the extra ones are helping with the CP, but I could be wrong.
I'll look forward to the pictures. They will be on a CD right??
c ya,
Sum
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Sum, as I read the rule, I believe the two additional "spill plates" would be interpreted as appendages to direct airflow, which are prohibited.
I pulled all my money out of c.d.'s and put them into the stock market. I need a reeeeel American postal address or you are out of luck.......... :-D Bob
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Bob and Sum,
I think I am more confussed on Rear Spoliers and Sill Plates now, although I am confussed at a much higher level and with much more knowledgable folks....
So in CGALT "classic gas Altered" can my 53 use a set up Like Hooley's ?
The way I read the rules I can,, but sure need to know and you ywo are the smartest guys I know "hmm but I don't know much" LOL
Charles
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Ligg, keep the pics coming.... great Chop Job from what I can see..
How much did you cut out front and rear ?
Charles
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Sum, as I read the rule, I believe the two additional "spill plates" would be interpreted as appendages to direct airflow, which are prohibited.
I pulled all my money out of c.d.'s and put them into the stock market. I need a reeeeel American postal address or you are out of luck.......... :-D Bob
That link does go to a real address:
Sumner Patterson
790 S. Main
Blanding, UT. 84511
The reason I asked about the CD was because I don't have a scanner anymore and if you send me old fashion pictures I'll have to take a picture of them and use that and the quality will go down some.
You might have a valid point on the additional plates on that spoiler, maybe Dan will weigh in on the subject.
c ya,
Sum
P.S. Charles as far as I'm concerned since you will be in Altered and since there is only one definition for spoiler/spill plates in the rule book I would say they can be the same as Hooley's (I'll call him today about the patterns...last night he was in the final round with his gasser Henry J).
Now the rules for a top chop in "vintage" (not your stude) altered and for a chop in comp coupe are written different and thus an area that I've wondered about.
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Sum, thanks for the info.. I hope you can get me Hooleys spolier and sill plate templates...
For Classic since the Stude is a 1953 I can Not chop the top, but as Altered I can run the spoliers and sill plates...
It would be nice to chop the top, but since I want to run classic I will leave the top alone and just do front and rear spoliers and drop her to the ground...
I am going to check with Alston on a cage kit,,, I hear they come pre bent and notched... can it be that easy ?? Nope I know... it's all hard work..
Charles
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Sum, by definition (mine, lol) Spill Plates are just that, spill plates. They are intended to keep the air from "spilling" off the edge of the spoiler rather than go over the gurney flap (wickerbill). The fact that they also help keep the car going straight is secondary. If I am wrong, I will refuse to admit it...................... :-D Bob
Charles, there is no way in HECK you will buy a cage that is ready to weld without a fit up/alteration. Buy a cheapo tubing notcher from Harbor Freight, and the BEST hole saw you can find like Lennox ,Dewalt or Milwaukie. Use a slow speed and LOTS of cutting fluid............... If I was you, I would spend the extra time and cash to add the funny car cage addition. It's a real bitch to add it later...............
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Bob, yes will add funny car cage,,, just hope I will still be able to fit in the car....
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Ligg, keep the pics coming.... great Chop Job from what I can see..
How much did you cut out front and rear ?
Charles
Thanks Charles.....we took out 5 inches....we ran out of gas welding....but when we finsh.......I'll post more pics of what we did...all the relief cuts and what not.
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Ligg,,, you ran out of Gas or the welder run out of gas LOL :cheers:
Charles
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What are you doing for the front end? Stock 55 Stude or going with the 53-54 style? My 55 has no good front sheetmetal, save a hood with the typical kinked rear corner. Therefore I am going with a fiberglass 53 style front. My build is for gas coupe class, so I will need to open up all the grille openings and also make the hood opening. I can run an air dam from the front bumper outer profile straight down. That's it for gas coupe, no spoilers or spill plates or top chops. Basically a stock body (and frame!!) with an engine swap.
Your chop looks nice so far, post up some more pics when you get a chance.
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What are you doing for the front end? Stock 55 Stude or going with the 53-54 style? My 55 has no good front sheetmetal, save a hood with the typical kinked rear corner. Therefore I am going with a fiberglass 53 style front. My build is for gas coupe class, so I will need to open up all the grille openings and also make the hood opening. I can run an air dam from the front bumper outer profile straight down. That's it for gas coupe, no spoilers or spill plates or top chops. Basically a stock body (and frame!!) with an engine swap.
Your chop looks nice so far, post up some more pics when you get a chance.
I would have liked to run gas coupe....but I had already done the mustang II front clip a few years back. So that would have put me in altered....then I saw Hooley's chop and decided to go for it.
I have all the 55 sheetmetal...my hood also has the kniked rear corner....but a few years ago I found one without the knik. My gandpa has a 55 president with a mustang II front clip and a big block 454 with tri power setup on it....I left all my front end with him....he likes haven extra stuff around....never know when some idiot down here in so cal could hit. I plan on runnin the fiberglass frontend....make it all one piece...easier to take on and off
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Having spent eleven years trying to change spark plugs and adjust valves while leaning over the front fenders on my Stude, I agree with the one piece removable front end idea. Unfortunatly for me, I basicly built the front half of the car with eveything from the air dam to the bumper to the core support, to the fenders, to the inner fender panels all bolted into one integral mass. Ugh!.......boy, to start over with a blank sheet of paper. That's why I recomend to all you newbies to go to Speedweek and TALK to the owners and drivers of EVERY similar car and get their opinions before you build yourself into a hole.
The School of Hard Knocks can be very expensive. When I finished my build, I had a pile of uneeded and unuseable parts worth over a thousand bucks. Changes are immenant, so try to plan ahead.
If I was to start over, I would put a lot more emphasis on serviceability and redesigning the door x-braces to be removable............lifting a four speed Lenco over the water tank and door braces really suck.............. also, I cannot remove the heads with the motor in the car...........ugh..........Bob
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What are you doing for the front end? Stock 55 Stude or going with the 53-54 style? My 55 has no good front sheetmetal, save a hood with the typical kinked rear corner. Therefore I am going with a fiberglass 53 style front. My build is for gas coupe class, so I will need to open up all the grille openings and also make the hood opening. I can run an air dam from the front bumper outer profile straight down. That's it for gas coupe, no spoilers or spill plates or top chops. Basically a stock body (and frame!!) with an engine swap.
Your chop looks nice so far, post up some more pics when you get a chance.
I would have liked to run gas coupe....but I had already done the mustang II front clip a few years back. So that would have put me in altered....then I saw Hooley's chop and decided to go for it.
I have all the 55 sheetmetal...my hood also has the kniked rear corner....but a few years ago I found one without the knik. My gandpa has a 55 president with a mustang II front clip and a big block 454 with tri power setup on it....I left all my front end with him....he likes haven extra stuff around....never know when some idiot down here in so cal could hit. I plan on runnin the fiberglass frontend....make it all one piece...easier to take on and off
My understanding is gas coupe can use a different front suspension, such as Must II based, but you have to still use the stock frame. In other words, no subframe clips. I am leaning to a dropped solid axle conversion myself. Simple and effective. The Jaguar front suspension is also a candidate along with the Must II style. No firm decisions yet.
The plan to make the front end removeable for servicing is a good one; I will make mine removeable. The better we all discuss and plan, then hopefully we have less do-over in our builds. I guess I should start a build thread soon for my project.
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38chevy,,, yep start a build page,,, looks like there is 3,4 or 5 of us all doing a Stude at the same time and from near abouts the same starting points... Ligg has the Chop done and getting with it....Snap seems to have a good plan and I have the basic car onsite, have the motor that I want to use done and in another car, but have yet tobegin any thing except the research on suspnesion, chassis and cage...
I wish us all good luch and great builds... do a post so we can all follow each others build up.
So far there is 38Chevy, Ligg, Snap and Myself. who else is embarking on new Stude LSR project ??
Charles
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Greetings All-
I am starting a '53 Studebaker. I hope to be ready for Speed Week 2010. If the market rebounds, it may be sooner.
Just yesterday, I came across some info on front suspensions for Studes.
Slick Street Stuff
865-525-6151
309 E. Anderson Ave.
Knoxville, TN 37917
slickstreetstuff@bellsouth.net
It does look "slick", as the name implies.
Hope this helps
Will6er
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Greetings All-
I am starting a '53 Studebaker. I hope to be ready for Speed Week 2010. If the market rebounds, it may be sooner.
Just yesterday, I came across some info on front suspensions for Studes.
Slick Street Stuff
865-525-6151
309 E. Anderson Ave.
Knoxville, TN 37917
slickstreetstuff@bellsouth.net
It does look "slick", as the name implies.
Hope this helps
Will6er
You have any pics, link or a description of what this front suspension is? Inquiring minds want to know......
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Looks interesting - http://www.studebakervendors.com/slickstreet.htm
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I was able to run in the classic class when the engine was mechanical injected but could not run classic when I went to efi.