Landracing Forum
Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => Build Diaries => Topic started by: bharmon77 on September 27, 2008, 12:20:21 PM
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I may be setting my self up for some harsh criticisum but it wouldn't be the first time. Has anyone had any good or bad experience with the Korean or China nock off turbochargers? Should I look at this cheap alternative or forget it? :-D
BHarmon
7077 H/BFL
(someday)
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I won't run any. I have a hard enough time keeping the "best" chargers intact, and take it off to inspect frequently. A turbo failure is one of the more dangerous problems that can happen due to the temperatures involved.
I would certainly take it up to max boost on a dyno first under full load. Just don't stand close when doing it.
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Best budget turbo bar none =
Master Power
Made in Brazil, very old company making great turbos (quality materials, tight tolerances and balanced).
Stay FAR away from China turbos. You can reserch MILLIONS of horror stories reguarding cheap knock offs.
Brands like XSpower (china) are all crap.
Master Power is the turbo brand I am going to use.
http://www.partsexpressonline.com/distributors_list.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfQks3Yu6Gk
(In spanish....but you can get the idea this is not a fly by night opperation and they make everything in house with state of the art equipment....watch this vid...you wont see anything like this from a China turbo)
-JH
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BTW:
www.bgturbokits.com
These guys have the best prices for MP turbos and lowest shipping cost.
They are also very friendly and happy to take the time to answer any questions.
I highly recomend them.
-JH
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Thanks for the help, I will follow up with your recommendations. I am trying to get my chassis painted right now, will assemble and get the strock Busa running including trying to modify (reduce) my stock wiring harness and then make a winter project out of the motor.
BHarmon
7077 H/BFL
(someday)
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modify (reduce) my stock wiring
Let me know if you need help with this, it can be rather tricky.
Remember:
Dont bypass the clutch switch by wiring it "always in", you will loose HP and RPM.
Get rid of the TOS, no matter how good you mount it, it will cause problems. (you cant just unplug it, let me know if you need to know how to bypass it).
Just a few of the mistakes I have made.
-JH
BTW:
How much HP you shootin fer?
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There unreliable.. a mate used a gt28 knockoff .. 4 hrs use on a zx9 till the exhaust wheel broke off .
Another friend put a t70 copy on a 2 lit car and it lasted sinilar but it broke the compressor and filled the engine with an aluminium jigsaw puzzle, others i know are having no probs but i think there running low boost and not on it often.
Master power are the Garrett of Brazil,widely used and i believe reliable,
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I wouldn't want to tar all no-name ebay turbos with the same brush.
A friend of mine has a factory that rebuilds turbos, had been doing conversions for a long time, and more importantly makes precision balancing machines. He had a salesman try and sell him some Chinese made turbos, and had one with him. My friend took off the covers and tried to check the balance. He aborted the test before the turbo got up to speed as he was about to over-range his sensors. If the sample was that bad, what are the production ones like? Certainly not better, he checked one of those too.
A colleague bought a 'T70', he was happy with it, and reported the kind of engine response that didn't make sense to me, but whatever. It failed, and he brought it in for me to look at along with another smaller turbo he'd bought. When I measured the wheels the 'T70' was more like a T3/4 and the smaller turbo was actually bigger. Neither was anything like the spec he thought he had. His new Garrett seems to be holding up Ok.
When I read the adverts I see a lot of technical turboesque words that sound impressive, but don't actually make any sense.
There is no reason why China can't make brilliant turbos, but until a serious player is prepared to put their name on them I won't put them on my car.
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I can also speak up for "knock offs gone wild". While I sell complete kits, I also help people with homebuilts and I have seen and heard the horror stories of inexpensive turbos. Stick with a name brand from a reliable source.
bharmon77- If you need help with the harness let me know. I have been performing the "thinning" of the 'Busa harness's for myself and several sandcar builders for over 7yrs.
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Its hard to know where parts are source and manufactured for the BIG name companies these days.
For example I attended an Engineering Exhibition here in Australia recently and came across a company that had turbine housings on display...had Garrett on the castings :?
Asked the question " are these for display only or do you manufacture them???
reply.."we have been casting Garrett Turbine housing for more years than we can remember. We have an automated foundry and intergrated CNC machining production line in house, then we freight directly to the USA once a month"...I thought he said 3000 castings per month :-o
I asked about the material specs and he said the nickel content per casting at current LME prices is about $80AUD .
so you never know.....
bit like the new Stainless Steel dishwasher I recently bought...thought we'd go "good German BOSCH ""quality""" and long and behold it turns up..manufactured and assembled in Turkey
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I think the turbos being referred to have certain special qualities:
1) Ebay Approved.
2) Seller must not use a spell checker.
3) Application should say: "Uh... What kind of car you have? YEAH! It fits that!"
4) Should cost less than a decent steak dinner for 4 people, including a couple drinks and tip.
5) If there is a "map" it will refer to their warehouse (or somebodies garage)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/T4-Turbo-TurboCharger-AR-60-COLD-AR1-0-HOT-RX7-Mustang_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1222Q7c39Q3a1Q7c66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c240Q3a1318QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem190253949676QQitemZ190253949676
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Its hard to know where parts are source and manufactured for the BIG name companies these days.
For example I attended an Engineering Exhibition here in Australia recently and came across a company that had turbine housings on display...had Garrett on the castings :?
Asked the question " are these for display only or do you manufacture them???
reply.."we have been casting Garrett Turbine housing for more years than we can remember. We have an automated foundry and intergrated CNC machining production line in house, then we freight directly to the USA once a month"...I thought he said 3000 castings per month :-o
I asked about the material specs and he said the nickel content per casting at current LME prices is about $80AUD .
so you never know.....
bit like the new Stainless Steel dishwasher I recently bought...thought we'd go "good German BOSCH ""quality""" and long and behold it turns up..manufactured and assembled in Turkey
i had not heard about Turkey :-o
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Its hard to know where parts are source and manufactured for the BIG name companies these days.
For example I attended an Engineering Exhibition here in Australia recently and came across a company that had turbine housings on display...had Garrett on the castings :?
Asked the question " are these for display only or do you manufacture them???
reply.."we have been casting Garrett Turbine housing for more years than we can remember. We have an automated foundry and intergrated CNC machining production line in house, then we freight directly to the USA once a month"...I thought he said 3000 castings per month :-o
I asked about the material specs and he said the nickel content per casting at current LME prices is about $80AUD .
so you never know.....
bit like the new Stainless Steel dishwasher I recently bought...thought we'd go "good German BOSCH ""quality""" and long and behold it turns up..manufactured and assembled in Turkey
i had not heard about Turkey :-o
BOSCH also makes the high end Thermador dishwasher. Oh well, so much for German manufacturing. :-o
I don't know how true this is, but I heard some of the forgings that are used for cranks and rods come from China. :?
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i read the same thing
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bit like the new Stainless Steel dishwasher I recently bought...thought we'd go "good German BOSCH ""quality""" and long and behold it turns up..manufactured and assembled in Turkey
The Stainless Steele dishwasher at my house was made in the USA, not sure if there is any "good German BOSCH quality" in its makeup, some English and Irish I think, it's 57 years old and still washes dishes like it did when it was 10.... :roll: :-D
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I don't know how true this is, but I heard some of the forgings that are used for cranks and rods come from China. :?
SCAT, EAGLE and Carrillo have various parts that are either cast/forged or made in China....trust me...
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I don't know how true this is, but I heard some of the forgings that are used for cranks and rods come from China. :?
SCAT, EAGLE and Carrillo have various parts that are either cast/forged or made in China....trust me...
That just makes me sick. :-o
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Say if someone told you that JE had their forgings or some off them made in China ??? or Korea or Taiwan.
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Say if someone told you that JE had their forgings or some off them made in China ??? or Korea or Taiwan.
Not yet as far as I know....and I would know ASAP..
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Thanks to JH and Hayaboosta,
I have not attempted to reduce the wiring harness yet, I did down load a couple of wiring diagrams. One diagram is titled FI System and appears to be everything that would be needed to make the engine run? The other diagram is titled Wiring Diagram for E-03, 28, 33 what ever that means? It includes all wiring including lights, etc. The harness is huge and a bit overwhelming for someone that does not do that kind of work, but I am determined to do it myself or maybe to myself? And will appreciate any and all help.
Thank you again,
BHarmon77