Landracing Forum
Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => 2017 and before: SW & WF => SpeedWeek 2015 => Topic started by: paso54 on July 21, 2015, 01:21:38 PM
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Now that I am slightly getting over the disappointment of not been able to run at Speedweek again this year. What is the general feeling that any events will happen in 2015. Having thought about it all day I would be looking at coming over for the World finals along with hopefully a few others from the Brit Motorcycle teams that came last year. Phil Steele Bike no 519. :roll:
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Both BNI and USFRA will be looking at the salt in a few weeks to decide, we are all hoping for some dry and good salt to run on. hang in there.
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Thank you for the job all of you are doing, I know its your best, don't want to see anyone hurt
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It's a little premature to ask about an event that is more than 2 months away.... Lets concentrate on BMST, WoS and Cook's Shootout Event before we start fretting the Finals.
Thinking about locking this one for 6 weeks.... :dhorse:
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Cousin Bob I was only asking... Family what do you do with Them. :-D
Only Kidding Stainless
Phil Steele :cheers:
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:wink:
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The 10 minute deluge this afternoon re-established Lake Bonneville.
Cooks were out the dragging when Mother Nature cried on the salt.
Takes more than Kleenex to sop up these tears.
When it's dry, they will again attempt to create a course.
Until then it's all supposition.
FREUD
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Thanks for the update. I have been curious if the World finals were going to happen or not. There hasn't been much talk about it lately.
I didn't know if the problem was just wet salt, which could be cured by some weeks of hot weather, or if there was a bigger underlying problem (besides all the talk of the salt disappearing, what changed since 2013 when it looked OK, if not a bit thin, to me).
If the area is a combination of salt and mud, if both dried, couldn't we run on both, kind of like a combination Bonneville/El Mirage course?
Jeff
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If the area is a combination of salt and mud, if both dried, couldn't we run on both, kind of like a combination Bonneville/El Mirage course?
Jeff
Here's the number for S&R towing in Wendover . . .
(435) 665-2622
:wink:
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If it dries, what do you need a tow truck for?
Jeff
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I guess once you call the tow truck you will understand.
The mud never dries.
FREUD
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Not only is the mud one stage from glue; the surface can look dry on top; then on the 2nd turn of wheel-spin, the body panels or axle is buried.
Jim
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I doubt if anyone can call a meet two months out -- even as grim as it appears.
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Stan, where is the "wit" you usually put into your posts.... that one was 1/2 of what I expected from you :roll:
folks stop :dhorse:
we will know if events will happen when we get there.... and even then rain can cancel them the first day
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The early AM report from BMST folks indicates the water on the salt-flats is LESS than what we drove through last year............and that the salt has SHIFTED, MUCH LIKE A SANDBAR.........to the WEST. If no more rain events............they feel the water will evaporate sometime next week :-)
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BMST just cancelled for 2015, it just gets worse.
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The sky is not falling...it s not getting "worse " since BMST cancelled
It is what it is ...not ready yet..
I praise SCTA and BMST for canceling since salt not ready
It's a good thing not to be treading out there at this time , its ready when it's ready, distance travelled, blood and sweat spent is irrelevant to the condition of the salt
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The sky is not falling...it s not getting "worse " since BMST cancelled
It is what it is ...not ready yet.. I praise SCTA and BMST for canceling since salt not ready
It's a good thing not to be treading out there at this time , its ready when it's ready, distance travelled, blood and sweat spent is irrelevant to the condition of the salt
X10 :cheers:
:fingerscrossed for WOS
(maybe i'll see Joea there??)
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Standby for the USFRA decision on 09/01. That will be the telling sign.
DW
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According to the SCTA facebook page, the World Finals is cancelled.
"I am very sorry to report that World Finals has been cancelled due to the condition of the salt."
https://www.facebook.com/SCTASouthernCaliforniaTimingAssociation/posts/507731436057310?fref=nf
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What the hell is going on??? The World Finals was scheduled to start on 9/29.
It's not even September yet! Will somebody please let me know why this event
was cancelled more than a MONTH in advance??
Maybe there's something going on that isn't visible to "normal" people like me.
Is it an approaching meteor that's going to destroy all of earth? Or is it something
more political, like -- I dunno -- the BLM banning all racing events on the salt flats??
I think I smell a rat, but it's kinda hard to describe further.
tallguy
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I imagine it's more to do with the area allocated to the organisers of the meet and their view that there simply isn't enough decent salt to prepare without cutting through into the goo underneath. Sid (Kiwi Belly Tank) went out there to collect samples and film a couple of weeks back. The results posted give a graphic illustration of how tough things are.
The International Course used by the Cooks is in an adjacent area but they go to great lengths to point out that things are challenging and very marginal even for running one vehicle. Take a look at the pic they posted showing how far back they've had to go with the start area. They also say please don't assume that the track they have prepared is suitable for a full meet with hundreds of entries. They are hoping to follow on from the Venturi private time event with the Shootout so I also imagine that they want to protect what looks like the only available area right now.
Sounds like the SCTA are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Cancel early to give best possible notice to those travelling long distances and many people will ask why so early. Leave it until the last minute and they'd be accused of not taking a tough decision if they always knew the surface would never be right this year. I may be wrong - but that's my take.
Robin
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2 down I possibility Left.
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What the hell is going on??? The World Finals was scheduled to start on 9/29.
It's not even September yet! Will somebody please let me know why this event
was cancelled more than a MONTH in advance??
Maybe there's something going on that isn't visible to "normal" people like me.
Is it an approaching meteor that's going to destroy all of earth? Or is it something
more political, like -- I dunno -- the BLM banning all racing events on the salt flats??
I think I smell a rat, but it's kinda hard to describe further.
tallguy
Where have you been? :?
Sid.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pe8de-Zhb6Q&feature=youtu.be
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Speculation on my part, but these events are not cheap to produce.
If the salt conditions are such that safe courses can't be made for August, and even assuming common use of a course or pit area groomed by USFRA, BNI would be starting from scratch to put together an event that has a traditionally lower turnout and a 50/50 chance of being cancelled due to weather.
That's a lot of time, effort and money to gamble after last year's hit to the organization, and no income from Speedweek to act as a cushion.
I think it's disheartening, but likely prudent.
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I don't know tallguy, but please give tallguy a pass on his lil rant.
Everybody boils over once in a blue moon.
Friends just shrug off their friend's rants (if they are very, very rare).
We ALL know that the SCTA/BNI folks are all racers and the LAST thing a racer wants to do is cancel an event.
So please ASSUME there is a good reason and ask what it is.
karl
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.......can you imagine...taking the time and effort
to go to the salt....drill and drill and video.. what remains of what
brought you to this country...and fuels your passions....
presented it here weeks ago...for all the world to see, with commentary
Sid....you are praised for being so reserved....
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I'm just a messenger that would like to go racing! :cry:
Sid.
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What the hell is going on??? The World Finals was scheduled to start on 9/29.
It's not even September yet! Will somebody please let me know why this event
was cancelled more than a MONTH in advance??
Maybe there's something going on that isn't visible to "normal" people like me.
Is it an approaching meteor that's going to destroy all of earth? Or is it something
more political, like -- I dunno -- the BLM banning all racing events on the salt flats??
I think I smell a rat, but it's kinda hard to describe further.
tallguy
Tallguy,
Calm down, no rat around, at least that I can smell.
Here is some stuff I have read on the internet that is at your disposal also.
Bonneville 2014, Rainout, Bonneville 2015, no track available due to Salt condition.
SCTA Facebook, Mojave Mile has 44 cars, and 38 motorcycles that say they will participate but the SCTA needs another 27 more entries to break even on the event.
SCTA website, Mojave Mile results, there were 17 cars registered to run at the Mojave Mile,
There were 33 motorcycles registered to run at the Mojave Mile.
From what I have read it looks like the Mojave Mile needed about 110 entries to show up for the event to break even, and only 50 entries made it. So from what I have read on the internet, it looks like this event cost the SCTA quite a bit of money. As I recall the entry for the two days was $425. Do the math.
The SCTA has been hit hard for the last couple of years in its pocket book, and I am glad that old timers like Grandpa Jim Lindsley, (RIP) and others horded the SCTA's money like it was their own.
If you think these decisions are easy for the current SCTA board, it is not, as they are all racers who want to be out there with their own cars or motorcycles doing what they love, putting on a safe race with a safe racecourse.
Sometimes Mother Nature (and other influences) are not kind to racers.
This is just my opinion on information gathered from the internet.
Tom G.
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Thank you Robin, Sparky, Sid, Milwaukee Midget, entropy, joea, and Tom,
for your responses.
I admit I was angry when I learned that the World Finals were cancelled.
I'm still angry, but not as much now. It's more like frustration. I do understand
about the "business/money" stuff (used to be a businessman myself. It wasn't
easy) . . .
If SCTA doesn't expect good salt a month from now, it appears to me that a
HUGE factor here is lack of salt. Moisture, of course, is a different issue that
certainly plays its own huge role.
While I do encourage all concerned to help get salt returned to the flats, I also
suggest that we do some thinking about other venues (longer than 8 miles).
I got interested in drag racing about 1966. At the time, there were 1/4 mile and
1/2 mile drag strips. Don't know whether any 1/2 mile drag strips exist any more,
as the length seems to keep getting shorter. What used to be 1/4 mile has been
changed to more like 1000 ft. (was 1320), and at least one 1/4 mile track I raced
at is now only 1/8 mile.
Compared to a large place like Bonneville, I can't get as excited by a one-mile, 1.3 mile,
or 1 1/2 mile top speed event (although I enjoyed watching the Mojave mile-and-a-half
in April this year, and El Mirage's 1.3 miles before that).
I am not denying the facts, such as encroaching population/economic pressures that
make it more and more difficult for land speed racing to happen on long courses. And
I'm trying hard to not criticize Intrepid. I'm willing to give them the benefit of any doubt
regarding returning brine to the salt flats . . . although I think Intrepid and their
predecessors are the ones whose actions most affected how much salt remains there.
I believe now that much effort and money will be required to "refurbish" the Bonneville
salt flats to make it suitable again for racing (with, say, 11 miles of "good" salt). I don't
claim to have many answers regarding how; it has been suggested that salt from the
general area be "concentrated" onto a "race course", having thicker salt -- and sides to
keep the salt contained. This sounds reasonable to me, although the brine may still tend
to soak deeper and deeper into the underlying ground, eventually being insufficient.
Maybe some other venues can be "developed" (or at least investigated) for land speed
racing purposes. For example, what do we know about Diamond Valley in Nevada? Is it
a suitable surface (salt? dried mud? how wet?) for land speed racing? How accessible is
it? It seems to be pretty close to Interstate 50. Is it private or public land? Does the
BLM let people onto it? Has any jet car team contacted the BLM about this?
There's also a dry(?) lakebed about 20 miles east of Lovelock, Nevada. What do we know
about this?
I imagine that somebody could conceivably build a paved raceway, say 12 miles long
and 100 ft. wide. I don't know how much it would cost to buy the property for this,
but after the purchase is a done deal, construction would only cost about $100 million
per mile. What are we waiting for?
More realistic, perhaps, would be some discussion related to the actual ground
surface at Bonneville (even if the salt is thin or relatively non-existent). Can vehicles
race safely on a mixture of dried mud and salt / salty dried mud? What would this
require? Of course, this presumes that people are still allowed to do this.
tallguy