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Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => Build Diaries => Topic started by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 12:54:28 PM



Title: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 12:54:28 PM
We started on this car while the Camaro was having the cage installed. Dennis Reeves of Reeves Fabrication will handle all of the welding and help with input on running and tuning the car. I love starting new projects. It takes your mind away from all the crap the world throws at you. As you can see by the condition of the car, this will be a project. The rust doesn't bother me as the basic shell of the car is pretty good. We don't have those beautiful, California winters here. This is what we work with.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0442.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0442.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0443.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0443.jpg.html)


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 01:10:25 PM
Off to the sandblaster. I was amazed at how much "metal" I lost during this process. It was way worse than it appeared. Still, the shell was pretty good. We are losing the floor pans and firewall anyway. Next step, get it off the frame and get the pans out of it.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0465.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0465.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0463.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0463.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0464.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0464.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0474.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0474.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0475.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0475.jpg.html)




Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 01:16:37 PM
Aladdin Garris of Garris Auto Body, Perryville, MO performed the blasting. He is very reasonable and works quick. The car was ready the next day and he actually cleaned more then we agreed upon. You don't get that kind of service often.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0476.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0476.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0477.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0477.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0478.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0478.jpg.html)

My grandson, Kevion, helping with the strip and teardown of the floor sheet metal.





Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 01:25:18 PM
I built the frame jig just for this project. We decided on a '69 Camaro front stub. You can buy any part to fit it for next to nothing and they are much more sturdy than some aftermarket front ends. I saw Andre's car at the Ohio Mile, he had the same setup and said he had been 210mph with his car. We're moving our wheelbase out 6" to 127".

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0494.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0494.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0495.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0495.jpg.html)

My son, Alex, getting the body ready to set up on the jig.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0500.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0500.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0502.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0502.jpg.html)



Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 01:32:36 PM
We're going to use this BMW engine for starters. It was in a Comp Eliminator Dragster and has plenty of good parts in it. At 215", it will be short of the cube limit. We want to make plenty of shakedown runs and this will do the job. Special thanks to Danny Byrd, one of my best friends. He supplied me with the 2 engines and I really appreciate his help. Hopefully, he'll help with some input on this project, too!

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0361.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0361.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0362.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0362.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0363.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0363.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0365.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0365.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0366.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0366.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0395.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0395.jpg.html)





Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 01:41:16 PM
Got the rockers welded in after everything was squared. Time to remove some rusty floorpans. At this time, I hadn't had my knee surgery, so my friend Regan came over and fired up the plasma.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0397.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0397.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0403.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0403.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0404.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0404.jpg.html)

No, we aren't using a PG. This is for mock up purposes. We'll be using a metric 200 for the BMW, simply because its already had all the engineering done and we're not going to buy two complete custom clutch set ups. We'll be switching over to a trailblazer engine pretty quick. We'll put the stick shift set up behind that one.






Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 01:43:18 PM
Just used an old driveshaft to mock the rearend location.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0405.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0405.jpg.html)


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Sumner on November 22, 2013, 01:47:49 PM
Thanks for posting all of the great pictures and this looks like it will be an interesting project.  I'll throw something out there about the front suspension.  I have a camaro sub-frame under the front of my truck (picture to the left) and love it.  Hooley put in a somewhat of a mustang type setup in the Stude and it will probably come out at some point.  Not sure how fast you are trying to run but we have gone from about 3000 lbs. to about 5000+ lbs. for traction and to get the center of gravity forward.  We are about at the limits of what we can find front springs for now.

The car will probably get changed to a solid front axle with leaf springs similar to what ...

(http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/bville-cars-3/787-1-06.jpg)

... Gary Hart had on his car that ran over 240 and seemed to handle very well.  Maybe Gary will jump in here with an opinion and more detail.  Not saying that the sub-frame won't work just maybe consider all options.  You don't need much travel at all and you want to make sure the car can't lift easily on the suspension,

Sum


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Sumner on November 22, 2013, 01:50:52 PM
.... We'll be switching over to a trailblazer engine pretty quick. We'll put the stick shift set up behind that one...

Would that be the Atlas 4200.  I just bought an Atlas 2.9 for the lakester.  If you are real familiar with these engines I'd like to talk at some point.  I've found some info on the internet and talked to the Self's but the more I can find the better,

Sum


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Rex Schimmer on November 22, 2013, 01:56:33 PM
Wade,
Nice start to what looks to be a great project. Great looking frame jig and I love the BMW engine!! Keep the post coming.

Rex


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Frankie7799 on November 22, 2013, 06:14:56 PM
Sweet looking start to a project Wade, yet another build Ill be tuned into


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: lsrjunkie on November 22, 2013, 08:05:01 PM
Sweet project Wade! First build of seen on here where somebody has started from the same point as myself. Tons of work, but it's gonna be cool. Keep us posted man!


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Geo on November 22, 2013, 08:39:18 PM
Wade,

I like it!  I'll be watching the progress!

Geo


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 09:47:27 PM
.... We'll be switching over to a trailblazer engine pretty quick. We'll put the stick shift set up behind that one...

Would that be the Atlas 4200.  I just bought an Atlas 2.9 for the lakester.  If you are real familiar with these engines I'd like to talk at some point.  I've found some info on the internet and talked to the Self's but the more I can find the better,

Sum

Sum, thanks for jumping in the build. I appreciate it. The 4.2 comes out in the Chevy Trailblazer. I don't know if it is considered an Atlas. They do have oiling issues, which I'm told is easily corrected with a dry sump. The 2006 and later uses the aluminum valve cover and is preferred because it has a much better exhaust port. I did originally Facebook the Self's at first about the engine. They won a race this past year with that combo. I since have talked with someone else who is also well known for making them fast. My guy's engine is 245" and makes 614 hp. This is a pic my son took of Self's car when we were down in Louisiana.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/Mobile%20Uploads/image-2.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image-2.jpg.html)



 


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 09:55:32 PM
My idea for the suspension is to use some weight jacks. We'll weld a spring cup to the bottom of the front control arm. Then brace the upper shock mount, enlarge the hole to accempt the jack screw and move the ride height where we want it depending on conditions. Same goes for the back, weight jacks to lower the ride height there also.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/Mobile%20Uploads/image-1.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image-1.jpg.html)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/Mobile%20Uploads/image.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image.jpg.html)

These pics are for the front. Are there some guys who have built something similar? Where have an idea of what we want, but, like lots of other forms of racing, its all theory until we put salt in the wheel wells.


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 22, 2013, 10:05:54 PM
We struggled with what front end to use. We talked about buying a glass Stude, pie cutting the side, sectioning it and narrowing the front. We finally decided to start with something a little slicker. This is very similar to what we'll use. I like the sleekness. They are plenty sturdy, guys have been 230mph with them. And, I like how it will help "reduce" the windshield area. What do you guys think?

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/IMG_0531.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/IMG_0531.jpg.html)

Of course, we'll only be using the frontclip.



Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Sumner on November 22, 2013, 11:02:44 PM
.... We'll be switching over to a trailblazer engine pretty quick. We'll put the stick shift set up behind that one...

Would that be the Atlas 4200.  I just bought an Atlas 2.9 for the lakester.  If you are real familiar with these engines I'd like to talk at some point.  I've found some info on the internet and talked to the Self's but the more I can find the better,

Sum

Sum, thanks for jumping in the build. I appreciate it. The 4.2 comes out in the Chevy Trailblazer. I don't know if it is considered an Atlas. They do have oiling issues, which I'm told is easily corrected with a dry sump. The 2006 and later uses the aluminum valve cover and is preferred because it has a much better exhaust port. I did originally Facebook the Self's at first about the engine. They won a race this past year with that combo. I since have talked with someone else who is also well known for making them fast. My guy's engine is 245" and makes 614 hp. This is a pic my son took of Self's car when we were down in Louisiana.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/wadeocustoms/Mobile%20Uploads/image-2.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/wadeocustoms/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image-2.jpg.html)

Yep the 4200 is one of the Atlas family motors.  The 5 cylinder and the 4 I bought are the same engine minus cylinders.  As you mentioned it is easy to run oil to the other mains with galleys that are already there.  The head does not flow oil back well so some recommend one stage of the dry sump to help with that.  I think for our longer pulls that needs to be addressed.  I recently bought an adapter from Marc in Canada that adapts the engine to GM transmissions and just got a G-Force 101A to use.  Not  sure what transmission you are planning but none of the trailblazers had a manual although one guy was making flywheels based on a couple that GM initially made.  I have a number of links to 4200 stuff that I've found that I could post or PM to you when we get back home if you are interested.

The engine has great heads that will flow up into the 300's very easily on the intake (the Self's are over 400 now), but like you mentioned need more work on the exhaust side.  The last I talked to Glen Self they had set a national record in the high 7's NA.  They have another motor they built that is making about 1400 HP I believe on only 15 lbs. boost.  Also there is an Opel running on the salt that has a current record with the motor.

I like the weight jacks and one thing you will have going for you is probably a better spring selection than what Hooley has on the forntend he used.  On the frontend shape I'd study the blowfish.  It has worked very well for them and I like how it appears to send more air down the sides of the car. 

We have talked about narrowing the front on Hooley's Stude but now I'm glad we didn't as all of the turbo plumbing and intercoolers has used all of it and Hooley lengthened the front 2 feet to boot and it is all used.  If you think at some point you might want to go blown I wouldn't narrow the car.  The body is still the wide point and dictates the frontal area so I'm not sure narrowing the front helps much, but that doesn't mean that a non-stock front wouldn't be better as I think it could as mentioned above.  Hooley wants to keep the Stude looking like one as much as is possible so he has the stock looking front.

BTW I'm a born and raised in MO guy that transplanted himself to the west  8-).  Good luck with the car,

Sum



 
[/quote]


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: SteveM on November 22, 2013, 11:51:47 PM
Great looking progress on that Stude!  Just FYI, I'm right up the road in Festus. I'll offer my help, but it looks like you have it pretty well under control.

Steve.


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: WZ JUNK on November 23, 2013, 09:14:12 AM
Interesting build.  I will be watching as you progress.  The Studebaker body that Hooley and I started with was not as nice as yours and it worked out fine.  You have lots of hard work ahead of you but I think you are on the right track.

I am in Missouri too but straight across the state to west about as far as you can go.

John


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: RichFox on November 23, 2013, 10:45:56 AM
I believe that Dennis Varni has an Atlas based engine in his record holding E/BGS. 334.260


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Sumner on November 23, 2013, 12:14:14 PM
I believe that Dennis Varni has an Atlas based engine in his record holding E/BGS. 334.260

You are right, it is a Falconer engine.  GM made a couple of these engines as I guess a kind of pre-runner to the production Atlas motors and then Falconer bought the powerplant and sells them for different applications.  His engines are...

(http://www.falconerengines.com/images/engine_galleries/falconer_l6/3/l6_3_3.jpg)

...beautiful and expensive and share few components with the production engine. 

It looks like the Atlas line is dead now in the U.S. at least since they stopped production for the Trailblazers and now also for the Colorado and Canyon pickups that will come back in 2014 but with new power.  The engine is tall and was limited in the platforms it could be used in and didn't get great gas mileage but does have a lot of HP potential with the DOHC 4 valve heads that can flow over 400 cfm.

More on the Falconer engines here...

http://www.falconerengines.com/falconer_l6.php?l6=main

.... where you can also see Dennis's engine...

(http://www.falconerengines.com/images/engine_galleries/falconer_l6/2/l6_2_13.jpg)

Sum


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 25, 2013, 05:37:14 PM
Sum and John, come on over! We'll have a Missouri family LSR get together! Any and all help is appreciated. Sum, could you forward those links to me;

wadeowen2007@yahoo.com

Also, check out Dennis' Facebook page at Reeves Racing. He is one of those guys who can do anything.

Like my Facebook page too please!

Or call me at 573-275-1618 cell

Rex, Frankie, lsr junkie, geo and Steve. Thanks a bunch for watching the build. Although we have been around and built cars all our lives, LSR is a new twist. I don't want to make any unrepairable mistakes and we want the safest car possible. Please chime in on ideas and thoughts.

Wade


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: GH on November 29, 2013, 08:18:25 PM
Wade, I live in Springfield Missouri. Sumner is correct, I used a dropped straight axle from Speedway Motors using a Vega steering gear. The car always went straight except between the 4 mile and 5 mile in 2009. Yours looks about like mine did when I started on it.


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Sumner on November 29, 2013, 08:59:58 PM
Sum and John, come on over! We'll have a Missouri family LSR get together! Any and all help is appreciated. Sum, could you forward those links to me;...

I PM'd the links to you.  Let me know if you didn't get them and if anyone else is interested I'll PM them to them also.

Not sure when I'll be back that way as I live in Utah now but if I'm near I'll try and stop so thanks for the invite and likewise if you are my way,

Sum


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Sumner on November 29, 2013, 09:06:48 PM
.....The car always went straight except between the 4 mile and 5 mile in 2009....

Would a big block with two turbos and possible wheel spin have anything to do with that outcome??

Sum


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: GH on November 29, 2013, 10:52:04 PM
Sumner, that was the only time it got crazy and that was the year that guy named Bryant got killed. One year I drove it left handed and never touched the wheel with my right hand. Wade, be careful with a front end that puts a lot of downforce on the front end. Lon Miller ran a front end with so much down force that they kept blowing front tires. Sumner, you remember that Stude, the yellow one from Oregon?


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Richard 2 on November 29, 2013, 11:41:04 PM
nice clean build, I like it.

I'm also in west Missouri.
Richard


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Wade_Owens on November 30, 2013, 03:23:52 PM
Sum, got all of the links. I'll be a few days reading those! Thanks for the help.

Gary, I talked with a friend who ran into you at Drag Week, Jarod Cochran. He hadnt heard we were building a car. He asked if I knew you. I said only by what you have accomplished and what I've read on the boards. Funny how things happen like that. And thanks for the tips on the front suspension/steering....

Tomorrow is welding day!

Wade


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: SPARKY on November 30, 2013, 04:30:41 PM
 :cheers:


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Reeves Racing on December 05, 2013, 11:00:52 PM
Hey everybody. This is Dennis from Reeves Racing. Got signed up and thought I'd say hi. Thanks for the kind words on our project. I'm sure we will be asking plenty of questions. Looks like there is a wealth of knowledge on this board.


Title: Re: E/GCC Studebaker Build....
Post by: Scottie J on December 05, 2013, 11:37:35 PM
Awesome project!  Looks like you guys are doing some great work to the body.  Can't wait to see this as it progresses.    :-)

Scottie