Landracing Forum

Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => Build Diaries => Topic started by: gshell12r on September 03, 2011, 08:44:09 PM

Title: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: gshell12r on September 03, 2011, 08:44:09 PM
Hi, all.

First post from a newbie so wish me luck!  :-D

A few weeks back I picked up a 2005 Kawasaki ZX-12 Ninja with hopes of making a land speed runner.

So far I'm just getting it built to safety specs so I'll actually be allowed to run. In the future I'm hoping to build the motor, put on a turbocharger, work with the gearing and electric bits, maybe do some mild streamlining, and then put it on a truck for Bonneville. Hoping that with the right combination of power, gearing, and aerodynamics I'll be able to set down a 250mph run.

Posting pictures soon!!

Always open to advice and input.


Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Peter Jack on September 03, 2011, 09:10:41 PM
I'd be getting a rule book for the organization with which you want to run. Study it carefully and follow it faithfully. Otherwise you may find yourself on the salt and not able to run. Good luck with your build. I hope it runs safe and fast. :-D :-D :-D

Pete
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Dr Goggles on September 03, 2011, 09:14:51 PM
Second that. You're running against some hard headed guys in those classes, but they all started somewhere.

Keep your ears open and your ambitions under your hat and I reckon you'll be in for the ride of your life.
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: 55chevr on September 03, 2011, 09:50:17 PM
G-   where are you from?  I would get all the rule books ... At the very least AMA which is online and SCTA ...
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: saltwheels262 on September 03, 2011, 09:58:39 PM
G-   where are you from?  I would get all the rule books ... At the very least AMA which is online and SCTA ...

and LTA.
hey?

bf


Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: 55chevr on September 03, 2011, 10:34:37 PM
thanks Bill --- LTA rulebook is online also ...
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: gshell12r on September 05, 2011, 05:43:57 PM
Hey folks,

Thanks for the support!

I know I'll be up against some pretty big guns but someone's got to be the underdog.

I've already got a 2011 SCTA rule book that I've been studying and using to bring the bike up to par. Its mostly all there since its a production based bike, I'll just be needing to pick up some odds and ends.

I'm based out of Spokane, WA right now, going to be headed to Cheney, WA in a year for schooling.
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Freud on September 05, 2011, 06:31:47 PM
It's nice to have another racer from Washington State. Since you live in Spokane you may make contact with Gary Harms. He's been there and done that

except he was with a roadster. He can still describe Bonneville........as much as any body can.

FREUD
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Seldom Seen Slim on September 05, 2011, 06:48:37 PM
Okay, Freud.  I give up.  Is that a cloudy day from 30,000 feet -- or the salt from about a half-inch?
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Freud on September 05, 2011, 07:17:34 PM
yes

FREUD
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Freud on September 05, 2011, 07:18:49 PM
Oh YA.........1/2 an inch.

If you really want to enjoy that picture, grab the right corner of the frame and expand the image until it's almost full screen.

These "now days" Panasonic Lumix cameras are adequate to do professional work if they are in the right hands.

I now use a Panasonic DMC-ZS10 for some of the images in the Target550.com web site. There are places where the

larger Nikon can not get into. I pull out the "Spy Camera" and get the image from a totally different perspective.

The salt image can not be done with the Nikon unless you dig a hole in the salt and get the lens down at ground level.

The optical axis of the Panasonic is 1" above the bottom of the camera. Just level the salt with your shoe and you are 1/2" above the salt.

You just have to be out there about 6:45 AM (MDT) to get the light at that angle. Ride with Bret Kepner and you will be there at 6:00AM.

FREUD
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: sabat on September 05, 2011, 07:22:37 PM
You might also want to get in touch with Muzzys Performance in Bend, Oregon. They have plenty of experience with turbo Kawasakis, and have built a number of successful Bonneville bikes. good luck, Dean
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: gshell12r on September 07, 2011, 12:44:32 PM
Had a look at Muzzy's, pretty sure they'll be getting the majority of my pay checks for the next few months, haha.

As far as boosting the ZX, the only place I've found that makes a turbo kit is tobefast.com and at $5k its a bit steep. Guess it really is a question of "how fast can you afford to go?"

One of my buddies at work has a motorcycle parts business here in Spokane that I've worked with in the past. Also does some dyno-tuning so I'm hoping to pull on that as a resource.

Just on the random: I know that a car's engine will handle about 7-10psi on stock guts before you need any serious upgrades, wondering if anyone has any experience/numbers on a motorcycle engine (specifically kawasaki). I've seen Hayabusas push 450+hp on  20+ psi but they've been built up a bit. 450-500 hp from a 1.2lt motor is no small feat so I'm trying to pull as much info as I can.

Thanks, folks!
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Seldom Seen Slim on September 07, 2011, 12:50:30 PM
Check with Terry Kizer - Mr. Turbo (www.mrturbo.com).  Also go directly to:  http://www.mrturbo.com/turbo-sys/kawasaki/zx12/zx12.html   He's the first of the big-time Kawasaki turbo guys and still does them out of his shop in Houston.  He's worked on a couple of our bikes, being the guy that first worked well with our Ninja 250 turbo - and gave me a quote for setting up one of our ZX14 bikes.  Ain't cheap - but it'll be about as good as you can get.  He visits Bonneville, too, working on Sam Wheeler's bike/liner and also the Moreau & McBride car (now the Flower of Scotland).  Both are Kawasaki turbo powered.  Say hi when you talk to him.
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: joea on September 07, 2011, 02:34:01 PM
a suitable turbo..500-850 $, an header to hold it 200$ and your own time fabbing/welding or around 500-750$ store bought..

wastegate 25-350$....injectors 300-400$....variable fuel reg 200 or so ...various ways to control fueling starting around 300....

......so around 3000 you can have everything to make 500 hp...but realistically need intercooling and or water injection and or methanol
to make over 400 hp for long periods of time....



but...by then you may wish you had spent another 1500-2000 to have bought a kit all thought out and proven out of the box...

rods 800-1100...pistons 500-600...heavy duty cylinder studs....

with that you can make 500 hp all day long....

Terry K. is great....thats who we have worked with also....272 mph with 999cc.....as well as Shane Stubbs over 269 mph...

Terry might not sound "warm and fuzzy" on the phone...but he is an incredibly caring racers friend...!!

Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: gshell12r on September 09, 2011, 11:24:16 AM
Yeah mrturbo is where I originally found the kit. Glad to know its a known brand. I'll for sure look into one. I'd rather have a kit too. I know there are some advantages to putting one together on your own (thanks for the info on that, by the way, joea, much appreciated) but I also know there are advantages of one thats already done up.

Looks like for reliable 400-500hp the motor's going to need about as much love as the turbo. Haha, oh well, tuition of life.

I'll be headed down to Bend, Ore first chance I get to check out Muzzy's
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: gshell12r on September 25, 2011, 08:43:50 PM
Hi, all.
Sorry I haven't been able to post pix yet. Camera is acting screwy. Got the kill tether done and putting the fuel line protector in soon.
Been looking for a digital-style gauge cluster/dash for the bike. Buddy of mine has a vapor set up but im needing something that will register 200+ mph. Yellr's yellobox speed un-limiter will be going in soon too. Any ideas??
Thanks for the help.
Pix are coming, I swear.
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: joea on September 25, 2011, 09:56:24 PM
Hi, all.
Sorry I haven't been able to post pix yet. Camera is acting screwy. Got the kill tether done and putting the fuel line protector in soon.
Been looking for a digital-style gauge cluster/dash for the bike. Buddy of mine has a vapor set up but im needing something that will register 200+ mph. Yellr's yellobox speed un-limiter will be going in soon too. Any ideas??
Thanks for the help.
Pix are coming, I swear.


Yeah...save yer money for parts that help ya go faster....

gauges usually dont...
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: fredvance on September 26, 2011, 10:47:08 AM
All I have is a shift light and a gear indicator. Can't seem to keep count of shifts. :-o
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Seldom Seen Slim on September 26, 2011, 12:04:35 PM
I sort of agree with Fred -- an analog tach and maybe a big "SHUT IT OFF!" light - which is illuminated by stuff like low oil pressure and other major issues.  I seldom see anything but the tach when I'm making a run (at least, only the tach on the dashboard -- I don't look at other gauges, and don't start on me not looking at the tracf and hitting the mile markers :roll:).

As for a shift light -- yes, that'd be nice, but I remember one bike that I teched a few years ago that had what appeared to be two shift lights.  The bloke (he was a Brit) explained:  "That one is my "shift" light, and this one is my Don't Shift Any More!! light".  Great idea -- an indicator to show that the trans is in top gear.  Would save lots of false shifts checking to make sure I'm in top gear.
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: joea on September 26, 2011, 12:12:58 PM
...good stuff...

all i have is a shift light...no gauges...but i frequently hit the shifter one more
time...not knowing where i am for sure...the secondary light or such may be good
addition....
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: fredvance on September 26, 2011, 12:59:21 PM
Some times even the minimal guages are over ridden by rider stupidity. At SW the shift light came on so fast in 6th gear that I did not believe the gear indicator and punched the shifter again. As usual no 7th gear. :? :cheers:
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Stan Back on September 26, 2011, 02:50:29 PM
I remember a rookie car and a rookie driver in a real fancy Street Roadster a few years ago.  All kinds of gauges clustered right in front of the driver.  Oil temperature, fuel pressure, etc.  Seems they left out the only one they eventually really needed -- a compass.
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: wobblywalrus on September 27, 2011, 01:58:04 AM
It seems the rookie run will be on a hot 1200 cc Kawasaki.  I will bet there will be no gauge reading during that pass.   
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Unkl Ian on September 27, 2011, 11:52:27 AM
Been looking for a digital-style gauge cluster/dash for the bike.


A lot of that high tech digital stuff is impossible to read in bright sunlight.
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Peter Jack on September 27, 2011, 01:55:39 PM
If you want to read gauges use analog and rotate them so the needles all point the same direction when everything is good. Under pressure digital can be difficult to read and interpret.

Pete
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: Seldom Seen Slim on September 27, 2011, 02:00:59 PM
A bunch of years ago I was selling big trucks -- and the manufacturer aligned all of the gauges to have needles at three o'clock when normal conditions were met.  Not that much vibration and extreme conditions as racers experience -- but fifteen or twenty gauges instead of our three or five.  It worked for them -- it's an idea for you.
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: saltwheels262 on September 27, 2011, 08:19:34 PM
with an analog tach and oil pressure gauge I always
positioned them so that redline and running pressure
were at 12 o'clock.


it didn't make a whole lot of difference with the tach
because the analog tachs always crapped out.
dakota digital is working pretty good.

franey
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: gshell12r on September 27, 2011, 09:11:19 PM
Thanks folks.

Yeah, after reading all this and finding that even a budget digi dash is still multiple-hundreds of dollars I think I'm going to scrub the fancy bits and put the cash towards something that will help the thing run better.
On a different note: not sure how many of you saw the initial post on this build but I had mentioned using a turbocharger to get me to 250. Welll the wallet had different ideas so I've had to scale back for now. Looking to boost compression, do a few power adders and gear ratio work, keep the thing N/A and shoot for 200. But for now: fire-sleeve and a chain guard.  8-)
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: joea on September 27, 2011, 11:52:11 PM
if your ultimate goal is around 250...then doing the other stuff now
will largely get in the way later when boosted...

meaning higher compression pistons and the like will be money wasted and
spent again later to garner lower compression etc...

if your aim is to go 200 asap then ya might need to but to what end...its not
going to break any records...and stock you can run 170's to 190's all day everyday...

and get to the most valuable return...experience running on the salt....

and by waiting you will then acquire the turbo system at a significant discount
because between now and then the bits and or the whole system will be found....very
economically....

Joe :)
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: gshell12r on October 02, 2011, 05:40:25 PM
yeah I know boosting compression is the opposite way to go if t-charging was in the immediate future. But after some thought into it, I'm not even sure I want to boost it even down the road. Just gonna keep it N/A and plan to take to the salt summer of 2013. Going summer of 2012 just to observe and get as much info and wisdom as I can.
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: gshell12r on October 20, 2011, 12:31:44 AM
New sprocket and chain set just in on friday. Went 40/18 for the sprockets with a DID 530 black and gold 10,000lb chain. Axles are on order as is the new clutch. Hoping to put it all together this week and hit the road sunday for a test ride (no, It won't be a top-speed run).
One question though: which bolts/fasteners need to be safety wired? I'm assuming axle fasteners and other "exposed" bolts and etc but I'm not 100% sure.
(Still can't get pictures loaded. Got them re-sized but the forum interface won't accept JPEG.. still trying).
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: 55chevr on October 20, 2011, 07:16:00 AM
Rear axle nut needs retention ... most of the bikes have a cotter pin from factory which is sufficient. Front is trickier, hollow axles that thread directly into the fork tube can be drilled from under the fork leg and a single safety wire installed.  We assist a lot of first time racers in the tech line. I will have safety wire and pliers. Remember metal valve stems and caps.

Joe
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: gshell12r on October 23, 2011, 10:42:09 PM
Rear axle nut cotter pin: check. metal valve stems: check.
Yeah I was looking at the front forks yesterday trying to come up with some way to secure the axles but the way you described sounds pretty solid.
Got the sprocket/chain set up installed yesterday and took it on a test ride today. Doesn't quite have the explosion that it used to in 1st and 2nd but I'm not having to slip the clutch like I was afraid I would. Success!
Title: Re: 2005 ZX12r
Post by: wobblywalrus on October 24, 2011, 12:31:34 AM
Don't forget to check the tightness of non-wired critical bolts at the track before you run, such as the trple clamp bolts and handlebar bolts.  Occasionally one of these will loosen due to all of the jiggling and bumping around during transit.  Especially if the bike is tied down by its handlebars.