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Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => Build Diaries => Topic started by: deadbolt on February 17, 2006, 08:47:11 AM

Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on February 17, 2006, 08:47:11 AM
Started working on a new project.  I have long been a fan of the Subarus.  I was actually the first one in my area to campaign one with SCCA to my knowledge.

Well we started working on building one for Maxton and perhaps even Bonneville once we get some transmission issues smoothed over.

Starting with a crashed WRX.  Here is what it looked like when I picked it up:

Looks great from the rear.

(http://www.boostplanet.com/yellow2.JPG)

Not so good from the front :(

(http://www.boostplanet.com/yellow5.JPG)

At the end of the first afternoon's work:
(http://www.boostplanet.com/yellowday2b.JPG)

Coming back from the frame shop soon so I will try to get more pics as we start putting it back together.
Title: Soob-a-roo
Post by: Seldom Seen Slim on February 17, 2006, 10:28:27 AM
Good thing those cars are rear engined, right?  (Yeah, I know better. . .)

I see the Soobs are running 140-145 at Texas, so now you know what your target speed might be.  You will be attedning some Maxton meets while putting the car together, right, and trying to figure out how to get to the Salt once or twice too -- right?

Nancy and I look forward to meeting you -- she just got her 6th Subaru -- plain Jane no turbo sedan -- but this is an '06 with sun roof and pimp wheels (17" spoked wheels stock on a Subaru?).  She enjoys seeing others with the Soob affliction.

We'll be at the 1-2 April meet -- find us and say hi.
Title: Re: Soob-a-roo
Post by: deadbolt on February 17, 2006, 11:05:08 AM
Quote from: Seldom Seen Slim

I see the Soobs are running 140-145 at Texas, so now you know what your target speed might be.  You will be attedning some Maxton meets while putting the car together, right, and trying to figure out how to get to the Salt once or twice too -- right?


Only 140-145?  :shock:  Wow!  I've done 145 at Road Atlanta in one.  I am thinking I can snatch a good 160-170 pass at Maxton and when my gears get here I should be able to turn it up to over 200 at Bonneville.  :twisted: I still have a lot of contacts inside SOA that are quite interested in seeing the first Subie to break 200.  We will be coming down to at least 1 or 2 Maxton events this year.  Just got my membership packet and schedule.

Quote from: Seldom Seen Slim

Nancy and I look forward to meeting you -- she just got her 6th Subaru -- plain Jane no turbo sedan -- but this is an '06 with sun roof and pimp wheels (17" spoked wheels stock on a Subaru?).  She enjoys seeing others with the Soob affliction.

We'll be at the 1-2 April meet -- find us and say hi.


I have the Subie bug bad.  For example, here is one of our wedding pictures: (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/picture_library/dir_20/car_portal_pic_10233.jpg)

My car - yellow on left, wife's car blue on right.
:lol:

I will try to find the full size pics showing all 125 of the cars that were there.
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: JohnR on February 17, 2006, 01:08:05 PM
Remember, It's not that the car cant go faster than 145, it's doing it at the end of the mile from a standing start!

FYI, to go 160 at Bonneville (short course, 3rd mile average) I needed 285 HP at the crank, 230 hp at the wheels.

To go 196 at Bonneville (short course, 3rd mile average) I needed 543 hp at the wheels but the course was way bad and I have a FWD.

My body (2001 Civic) is about the same frontal area as a WRX but I would suspect it's a little cleaner aero wise.

The AWD will hurt you in the low HP runs since you will not be traction limited but as the HP climbs over 300 or so it will help alot.

Just my $0.02
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on February 19, 2006, 10:36:50 AM
Quote from: John Romero
Remember, It's not that the car cant go faster than 145, it's doing it at the end of the mile from a standing start!

FYI, to go 160 at Bonneville (short course, 3rd mile average) I needed 285 HP at the crank, 230 hp at the wheels.

To go 196 at Bonneville (short course, 3rd mile average) I needed 543 hp at the wheels but the course was way bad and I have a FWD.

My body (2001 Civic) is about the same frontal area as a WRX but I would suspect it's a little cleaner aero wise.

The AWD will hurt you in the low HP runs since you will not be traction limited but as the HP climbs over 300 or so it will help alot.

Just my $0.02


There's a guy in NC that hit 157 at Maxton in his Subaru WRX station wagon, also just a 1 mile.

This will be an 06 which should be a little better at cutting through the wind than the older cars.

Power won't be a problem, we are going to be in the 900 HP range when we get done.

Thanks for the input.
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: Sumner on February 19, 2006, 10:57:21 AM
Quote from: John Romero
FYI, to go 160 at Bonneville (short course, 3rd mile average) I needed 285 HP at the crank, 230 hp at the wheels.

To go 196 at Bonneville (short course, 3rd mile average) I needed 543 hp at the wheels but the course was way bad and I have a FWD.


John from those numbers with a good course I think with the 543 hp you should be good for 212 using the 8 times the hp to go twice as fast rule.  I'll be interested in seeing how close you come to that in 2006.

Hopefully you will be faster than that :D .

Deadbolt if your car is similar aero wise to John's and you can actually make 900 hp (to the rear wheels) and get it to live for 3 to 5 miles (at Bonneville), one I'll be very impressed and two you should be running about 250!!!  200 will be quite an accomplishment.

c ya, Sum
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on February 19, 2006, 06:54:47 PM
Quote from: Sumner
Quote from: John Romero
FYI, to go 160 at Bonneville (short course, 3rd mile average) I needed 285 HP at the crank, 230 hp at the wheels.

To go 196 at Bonneville (short course, 3rd mile average) I needed 543 hp at the wheels but the course was way bad and I have a FWD.


John from those numbers with a good course I think with the 543 hp you should be good for 212 using the 8 times the hp to go twice as fast rule.  I'll be interested in seeing how close you come to that in 2006.

Hopefully you will be faster than that :D .

Deadbolt if your car is similar aero wise to John's and you can actually make 900 hp (to the rear wheels) and get it to live for 3 to 5 miles (at Bonneville), one I'll be very impressed and two you should be running about 250!!!  200 will be quite an accomplishment.

c ya, Sum


I meant crank HP and with the all wheel drive we lose a lot more power through the driveline than 2wd cars.  If we make 900 crank, we will only be getting about 700-705 to the wheels, depending on the dyno ( I have actually seen as much as an 80 hp difference in two different dyno machines reading the same car. :shock:  )  Not sure on the aerodynamics of the two cars compared together.
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: LittleLiner on February 20, 2006, 12:24:52 PM
With all wheel drive you are limited to runnig Maxton's Street Classes or the Production classes.  Both categories allow many mods but in any case you should be carefull to stay within those rules or you might end up with a "Time Only" machine.
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on February 22, 2006, 08:26:27 PM
Quote from: LittleLiner
With all wheel drive you are limited to runnig Maxton's Street Classes or the Production classes.  Both categories allow many mods but in any case you should be carefull to stay within those rules or you might end up with a "Time Only" machine.


Waiting to get the rulebook to do the big mods, right now we are just reconstructing the body.  It will be for the production class due to the speed restriction in the street car classes.
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: LittleLiner on February 23, 2006, 09:38:32 AM
There are no speed restrictions in the Maxton street classes.  Over 2 dozen of the Street Class records exceed 150mph. The fastest street record is over 189mph.

Of course if you have a street legal car that goes faster than 135mph you need to also have the appropriate safety gear for the speed you run.  An example would be the requirement for a parachute at over 175.  

The speed restrictions come into play for cars without some of the required safety equipment like fire system, cage, etc.  

So with all wheel drive, if you keep the Subaru street legal but make mods that push it out of Production Category, your only choice is the Street Categories.  Just add the required safety items.   An example of something that would disqualify you for production would be adding non-stock body parts like wheel flairs, spoilers and wings.  Another thing that would disqualify you from the Production Category would be running fuel and/or nitrous
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: Stan Back on February 23, 2006, 12:02:27 PM
Does mixing years' body work make it an altered at Bonneville?  With the dreaded fraction control AWD?
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: dwarner on February 23, 2006, 12:23:47 PM
The mixing of body work does not change a Production class car to a Modifed (Altered or Gas Coupe class) car. An F body Camero or Firebird is still an F body for all inclusive years. You can put different year front clips on the same body generation. The addition of fabricated spoilers, air dams, etc will change classes if the other criteria are met, such as engine swap, quickchange, etc.

DW
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on February 23, 2006, 09:30:04 PM
Quote from: LittleLiner
There are no speed restrictions in the Maxton street classes.  Over 2 dozen of the Street Class records exceed 150mph. The fastest street record is over 189mph.

Of course if you have a street legal car that goes faster than 135mph you need to also have the appropriate safety gear for the speed you run.  An example would be the requirement for a parachute at over 175.  

The speed restrictions come into play for cars without some of the required safety equipment like fire system, cage, etc.  

So with all wheel drive, if you keep the Subaru street legal but make mods that push it out of Production Category, your only choice is the Street Categories.  Just add the required safety items.   An example of something that would disqualify you for production would be adding non-stock body parts like wheel flairs, spoilers and wings.  Another thing that would disqualify you from the Production Category would be running fuel and/or nitrous


It will definately have a chute (actually planning for two).  All the body parts will be Subaru components for the maxton event, maybe some changes for the high-speed run at Bonneville.  The car will be running on straight 93 octane pump fuel, and I am not a big fan of nitrous so we will be staying away from that.  Cage fab starts as soon as I get my rulebook, that is one thing I learned from SCCA, rule book in one hand, tubing in the other. :lol:

Thanks for all the helpful suggestions guys!  It is very helpful and very much appreciated.
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on March 16, 2006, 07:12:16 PM
(http://www.boostplanet.com/nose1.JPG)

Got the refurbished nose fitted this weekend. :D
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: wolcottjl on March 17, 2006, 07:08:55 PM
Quote from: dwarner
The mixing of body work does not change a Production class car to a Modifed (Altered or Gas Coupe class) car.
DW


How about a european car sold in the US with big bumpers - Could you go with the smaller european bumpers for the same car?
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: dwarner on March 17, 2006, 09:13:23 PM
Yes
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on April 16, 2006, 07:52:26 AM
More update pics:

Yesterday I removed the twisted crossmember and control arms:

(http://www.boostplanet.com/crossmember.JPG)

And replaced them with new goodies straight from Subaru:

(http://www.boostplanet.com/newcontrolarm.JPG)

Also, thanks to our body shop mixing up a little basecoat for me, I colored in all the structural sheet metal that we had replaced; radiator support, frame rail, inner fender, etc.

(http://www.boostplanet.com/yellow_paint1.JPG)

Hopefully we will have it ready for paint within a couple of weeks! :D
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on August 09, 2006, 09:49:57 PM
Got the body parts back from the painter and put on for test fitting.  Came out pretty darn good considering what we started with.  

(http://www.boostplanet.com/noseon.JPG)

Now we have to put the stock drivetrain back in and get the NC-DMV to come out and inspect it to give us a title for it.  Hopefully we will be starting on the caging, cell, etc. within a couple of weeks!
 :D
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on August 21, 2006, 08:33:05 AM
Quote from: deadbolt
(http://www.boostplanet.com/nose1.JPG)

Got the refurbished nose fitted this weekend. :D


With lights and other goodies:

(http://www.boostplanet.com/yellow_headlights2.JPG)
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on August 27, 2006, 02:11:00 PM
Well, started gutting it out this weekend:

(http://www.boostplanet.com/yellowgutted.JPG)

(http://www.boostplanet.com/yellowgutted2.JPG)
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: QuikWgn on August 31, 2006, 12:14:04 AM
Hey Dead...Saw the nosejob over @ Nasioc and it looks pretty sweet.  Me...I'm just getting ready to go find the candidate for my project after Labor Day.   My handle here is the same as @ NASIOC so just search for North America's Quickest Wagon and get caught up.  When do you figure you'll be ready for a LSR attempt? I figure the groundbreaking nature of my project will put build time for my self-financed venture @ 18 months.  Stuff like the custom Surgetank/Intake plenum will take Hogan's awhile since they have a lot of flowtesting and calculations to do for a one off manifold.  At least we won't be in the same competition class so that'll keep things a little more mellow especially since we are so opposite, with you on the East coast with a gas Sedan, and me on the West coast with a Methanol Wagon. Good Luck to ya man!!!
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on September 03, 2006, 10:47:38 AM
Quote from: QuikWgn
Hey Dead...Saw the nosejob over @ Nasioc and it looks pretty sweet.  Me...I'm just getting ready to go find the candidate for my project after Labor Day.   My handle here is the same as @ NASIOC so just search for North America's Quickest Wagon and get caught up.  When do you figure you'll be ready for a LSR attempt? I figure the groundbreaking nature of my project will put build time for my self-financed venture @ 18 months.  Stuff like the custom Surgetank/Intake plenum will take Hogan's awhile since they have a lot of flowtesting and calculations to do for a one off manifold.  At least we won't be in the same competition class so that'll keep things a little more mellow especially since we are so opposite, with you on the East coast with a gas Sedan, and me on the West coast with a Methanol Wagon. Good Luck to ya man!!!


Eek!  I've been spotted!!! :lol:

We have run into a couple of road blocks here, we were shooting to have the car ready for Maxton in late October, but it looks like it might not happen.  We might thrash on it over the winter to get it ready for some SCCA SPO competition for spring time then to Bonneville for September '07.
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: aspera on September 11, 2006, 09:54:04 AM
Fellow Nasioc-er here.  I'll be at Bonneville '07.  Anything I can do to help?  Need a gopher?

2006 was my first trip to Bonneville.  It won't be my last. :D

EDIT:  I found this link that might interest Subaru folk.  The SVX looks pretty slippery.

http://www.mayfco.com/subaru.htm
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: QuikWgn on September 12, 2006, 05:29:40 PM
I considered an SVX w/ its Cd of .29, but it would require a lot more fab work in my opinion to retrofit my choice of powertrains, caging the wagon will be MUCH easier than an SVX, and there is a lot you can do in the modified production/altered classes to make a WRX (only has a Cd of .33 stock for sedan AND wagon http://www.cars101.com/subaru/impreza/wrxsti2004.html ) more slippery (why I chose a wagon + rear downforce is easier to control ie a 1" wickerbill on the trailing edge of the wagons roof vs the same on the sedan's trunk) plus the weight of a stripped down WRX(3160 curb weight for Wagons) is less than an SVX(3580lbs curb weight) would be, though I'm giving up the stability of the SVX's longer wheelbase of 102.8" vs 99.4" for the WRX .
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: aspera on September 13, 2006, 07:50:01 PM
It sounds like you put some thought into it.  Have you seen SubiGal's roll cage in her rally car?  There's lots of room in a wagon for straight tubing.

For stability, wouldn't the rear side window surface area help keep the car pointing forward?

The wagon has those narrow non-flared fenders, too.

Do the rules let you replace the spare tire tub with a flat plate?  I've seen that done on EasyStreet's drag car.  Can you run a skidplate like Primitive's?
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on September 14, 2006, 08:16:07 AM
Quote from: aspera


Do the rules let you replace the spare tire tub with a flat plate?  I've seen that done on EasyStreet's drag car.  Can you run a skidplate like Primitive's?


I think that would fall into non allowed mods for Production classes. :(
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: JohnR on September 14, 2006, 12:11:59 PM
Quote from: aspera
Do the rules let you replace the spare tire tub with a flat plate?  I've seen that done on EasyStreet's drag car.  Can you run a skidplate like Primitive's?


I am assuming that you would be doing this to clean up the aero under than car. If so, not only would this be illegal in Production but it would probably be illegal in Altered as well. You cant get a bellypan untill to go to Comp Coupe. The question is if it would be considered a bellypan or a step pan.
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: aspera on September 16, 2006, 09:38:31 AM
Does that include the factory rear diff guard? STi rear diffuser? Front splash guard?

Wouldn't removing the front U-shaped subframe clean up the aero? Do the rules allow you to take stuff off?
Title: LSR Subaru attempt
Post by: deadbolt on September 27, 2006, 04:36:56 PM
Quote from: aspera
Does that include the factory rear diff guard? STi rear diffuser? Front splash guard?

Wouldn't removing the front U-shaped subframe clean up the aero? Do the rules allow you to take stuff off?


I think since the diff guard and front splash guard are dealer or port installed and not factory installed options they would not be allowed.

The rules won't allow much in the way of removal of parts.