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Author Topic: MS LIBERTY a Wild Weasel's belly tank  (Read 428061 times)
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SPARKY
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« Reply #405 on: March 06, 2012, 07:34:02 PM »

Dave, Joe and John came by today, Dave mostly finished an adapter on the lathe that he need for a project at home---Joey got in 3 GOOD hours on final welds for the joints he can get to from above.  Dave and Joey had to leave at lunch---John and I trimmed the nose plates and tacked them. 

This week I will cope the tube that the shoulder belts go over on the seat back, then be can attach the harness. We already have the lap belt brackets flame cut.  We then will need to install the inner panels and see if we can still get in and out.  I tried it today with out fire suit and with the seat bottoms welded in we picked up some clearance.  WE WILL BE SECURE!!! shocked
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Miss LIBERTY,  changing TKI  to noise, dust and RUST!!!

The # 1 issue is: TO KEEP THE REPUBLIC      
   Center for Self Governance            tncsg.org     mrspowell.org

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller
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« Reply #406 on: March 06, 2012, 10:24:46 PM »

Roger that, sounds good! You forget how that camera works? grin
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« Reply #407 on: March 09, 2012, 12:45:28 AM »

Andy and I had a great evening of bingenginering---noodled out the next moves-- we will use a plump bob to make the center lines on 4 places on the frame and install the vertical "stake" so that we will be able to track how much torsional twist we have when we cut it loose frt and rear.. we also figured out the rt axle mounting system so that we can align the frt axle and change the wheel loadings---it is simple enough that we Aggies understand it!!

We will then cut the frame from the weld jig and move it forward 80" so that we can align and lock down the rear frame behind the rear axle---we then will install all of the braces and cross members for the push bar and chute mounts.   And then, and then we will install the jig on its  end stands so that we can "lean" it to the right and then lean it to the left for welds.  take it off the jig and roll it on the floor to weld the bottom.

Some time during all of this we will finish assembly of the axles and we will have a ROLLER!!!! cheers
« Last Edit: March 09, 2012, 08:49:52 PM by SPARKY » Logged

Miss LIBERTY,  changing TKI  to noise, dust and RUST!!!

The # 1 issue is: TO KEEP THE REPUBLIC      
   Center for Self Governance            tncsg.org     mrspowell.org

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller
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« Reply #408 on: March 09, 2012, 09:01:34 PM »

Photo update coming! Dave and I moved the frame forward 80" when we cut it of the frt. lock down it ----"twanged" to the drivers side about 3/8" at the very front when we realigned it on the weld jig and I cut one tack weld in a bottom plate and it came back about 1/2 of that---I am happy to have  3/16" off center  over 207"  on frame only---we will try to  work that out when we hang the body shell  tongue

MC Doug R came by for a visit and helped me tack the rear frame on two more cross members so that when we work on nailing the back oval we can cut, ratchet strap, and pull with out moving the front. 

Wow we are getting close to taking this thing OFF!!!

Pict to come this weekend
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Miss LIBERTY,  changing TKI  to noise, dust and RUST!!!

The # 1 issue is: TO KEEP THE REPUBLIC      
   Center for Self Governance            tncsg.org     mrspowell.org

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller
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« Reply #409 on: March 10, 2012, 12:49:30 AM »

Don't worry about being off that little, your weld schedule.....as in your pattern will make up for it as you work your way around the frame.
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« Reply #410 on: March 10, 2012, 06:07:10 AM »

T-M 
I am welcome to coaching on my weld schedule.  The only thing I have been doing is not do a whole weld at once.  I know to tack and clamp down then alternate, side to side as well as end to end.  I do not have enough experience to have a feel or insight as to how a weld is going to pull other than on a butt weld I do know about the hinge effect.  I do think that all in all that I have done a slightly above average job so far.  So far there have been 3 different inspectors in my shop looking at the progress and have at least not said redo this or I would revisit that. 

All in all this car so far is starting out much more symmetrical than the old car, maybe it will not be as hard to get it to go STRAIGHT. Straight and true is GOOD!  grin
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Miss LIBERTY,  changing TKI  to noise, dust and RUST!!!

The # 1 issue is: TO KEEP THE REPUBLIC      
   Center for Self Governance            tncsg.org     mrspowell.org

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller
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« Reply #411 on: March 10, 2012, 12:13:38 PM »

I find it instinctive so I will not be a very good coach! I just sort of keep a good eye on things and try not to worry so much and hamstring myself. Sounds like you are getting there just fine.
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« Reply #412 on: March 12, 2012, 12:10:40 AM »

Between Taxes, watching Tony win, and chasing parts I got an off and on 3 hours noodling my alignment issues.. i think I am just going to have to get the 1/8" in the front with outer shell adjustments and the tail I can "encourage" straight by diagonal installation. tongue 

Then picts.  I promise
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Miss LIBERTY,  changing TKI  to noise, dust and RUST!!!

The # 1 issue is: TO KEEP THE REPUBLIC      
   Center for Self Governance            tncsg.org     mrspowell.org

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller
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« Reply #413 on: March 12, 2012, 02:58:56 AM »

The way to think about weld distortion is to remember that the shrinkage happens toward the heat. If you weld an unrestrained square tube on one side it will form a shallow vee with the weld being on the inside of the vee. The weld will also shrink in the direction of the weld. That's why if you weld together two sheets and they aren't properly tacked first they come tighter and tighter together until often they'll overlap.

When you're welding a structure such as a space frame always use careful, close fit up with lots of tacks and then try to work such that the next weld you make offsets the effect of the one you made immediately previously.

A careful approach can eliminate much of the distortion and twisting from any sort of structure.

If you do run into a serious distortion problem and you have a strong jig or surface plate you can sometimes straighten things out by clamping the structure down firmly and heating each joint to dull red and letting it cool. This is definitely not the preferred way but it can help save some structures.

I hope this helps.

Pete
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« Reply #414 on: March 12, 2012, 04:49:35 AM »

Further to distortion and straightening.

If you have a gentle bend or are trying to induce a gentle bend in something heat can also be your friend. A good example is either straightening or adding camber or toe to a rear end housing.When you apply heat to a spot on the tube the tube will form a very shallow vee away from the heated area. If the spot is made red hot and then allowed to cool or in some cases forced to cool with water or air the piece will pull more than it expanded thus bringing the ends in the direction of the heat affected zone. This knowledge can be used to make some amazing repairs or adjustments.

Be very careful using rapid cooling as it can lead to brittleness in many materials and brittle leads to breakage. On the other hand if it is practical to use rapid cooling methods the effects of the heating and cooling can often lead to greater movement.

Pete
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« Reply #415 on: March 12, 2012, 08:12:52 AM »

PJ 
Thanks for the coaching,  I will try the two heat techniques next.

  I have 3 tubes in the top that form  6' long triangles and two in the bottom of the tail section. These are presently tacked to the 8" x 24" oval at the rear.
  I "hot welded" one of the lower last night with it under compression with a ratchet strap and it helped some on the lower, it has very little to go.

The upper is where I will get the rose bud out and play some following your suggestions. I also can weld in two diagonal braces the get the rest out ( I think). lol
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Miss LIBERTY,  changing TKI  to noise, dust and RUST!!!

The # 1 issue is: TO KEEP THE REPUBLIC      
   Center for Self Governance            tncsg.org     mrspowell.org

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller
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« Reply #416 on: March 12, 2012, 07:56:52 PM »

WOWee Sowee----got the rosebud out,  ratchet strap pulled the upper just about 3/16 past wher I wanted it to end up---and, and then ---I normalized the three welds as per PJ suggestion  then heated up about 6"-8" to pink on side of the two uppers that I wanted to push away from---then to the other side reheated the joint "red" then kept going back and forth on the side I wanted to pull toward---I just moved the rose bud back and forth length wise untill I had 1.5" band about 12" long that was also red.  left the strap on for 2 hrs to cool down---

got out the tape---could not believe it  spot on up and down oval vertical  grin

Thanks again to all who post and help each other out!!!! 

I have no doubt I can move the front the less than 1/4' (" lol) it needs!!!
« Last Edit: March 13, 2012, 12:26:55 AM by SPARKY » Logged

Miss LIBERTY,  changing TKI  to noise, dust and RUST!!!

The # 1 issue is: TO KEEP THE REPUBLIC      
   Center for Self Governance            tncsg.org     mrspowell.org

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller
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« Reply #417 on: March 13, 2012, 05:32:25 PM »

I don't care what "they" say, some of those guys from east Texas are pretty sharp!! evil
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« Reply #418 on: March 13, 2012, 11:19:04 PM »

I know that was meant to be a compliment  shocked   --yeah but with a bad case of East Texas mush mouth---  lots of folks take a while to figure that out!!  grin  lol
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Miss LIBERTY,  changing TKI  to noise, dust and RUST!!!

The # 1 issue is: TO KEEP THE REPUBLIC      
   Center for Self Governance            tncsg.org     mrspowell.org

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."   Helen Keller
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« Reply #419 on: March 14, 2012, 08:40:30 AM »

Fred... I knew Sparky was an easterner... but now I think since he lives in "western Texas"  grin he is gaining speed on his expanding (knowledge) base   grin
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