What have we learned from the 4 cars that have just gone 400?

[Rex Schimmer]

I am sure that most of us have been waiting for every update from Jon at the Doug Cook FIA meet and I know that I have really been impressed by all of the cars but especially the Spectre car. They have taken a car built a number of years ago by Roy Fjasted and I don't think it ever ran over 285 with Roy then Junior Kirtz bought it and it ran a best of about 310, Junior proceeded to drop a large sum of $$$ at Ron Scheafers and did not go any faster. The guys from Spectre bought the car and in the vernacular of drag racing "back halfed it" by adding an aero back end and some more wheel base to the car and have now ran over 410 with a Caddy engine. Of all of the cars that have just done the 400 number I would bet that the Spectre car has probably the least horse power. I know they were talking around a 1000 when they went 360 last year so to go 400 they would need around 1400 hp, my guess is that both the BBCs of Nish and the Spirit of Rett cars are probably over 1500 on fuel and the number that I hear for the Speed Demon is over 2000 hps. So what can we deduct from numbers? 1. I think that the Spectre car has probably the most efficient aero shape with Nish and the Spirit of Rett second and the Speed Demon last. 2. The Spectre car is definitely not a "flat bottom" design, nor is the Nish car the Spirit of Rett is somewhat of a little of both and the Speed Demon is definitely a flat bottom design.

Ok I have kind of layed out some of my thinking please add as you see fit.

Please remember that this is all just conjecture and for fun and trying to learn more about the characteristic of the different streamliner design ideas. What is yours???

Rex 

[Kiwi Paul]

Rex, it would be interesting to look at all the wheel driven cars that have run that speed.....the Campbell, Mickey Thompson and Summers Bros cars were brute force behemoths with doubtful aero qualities, but the Spectre and Teague cars heve similar shapes, as do the Nolan/Rick White and Burkland cars ( very generally, this is) and that leaves the two Vesco bodied cars as similar. Interesting that Poteet/Main are following a different trail. And what about the next batch of cars being built? We have seen the Treit/Davenport and Evernham/Herbert designs...and now Rob Frey has gone a completely different route..........Thoughts, Anyone?

[gearheadeh]

Rex, it would be interesting to look at all the wheel driven cars that have run that speed.....the Campbell, Mickey Thompson and Summers Bros cars were brute force behemoths with doubtful aero qualities, but the Spectre and Teague cars heve similar shapes, as do the Nolan/Rick White and Burkland cars ( very generally, this is) and that leaves the two Vesco bodied cars as similar. Interesting that Poteet/Main are following a different trail. And what about the next batch of cars being built? We have seen the Treit/Davenport and Evernham/Herbert designs...and now Rob Frey has gone a completely different route..........Thoughts, Anyone?

I noticed the obvious similarity....Do we know how much power Al had to go 409?

[SPARKY]

from what I "think I know"  I would bet that the Golden Rod was the most aero of them all---they just had a very inefficent drive train---was made of huge truck parts.

I have "heard" that Al had at the most around 1600---remember he had a 432 speed also.

IT remains TE what you can hook up---ie traction control is now on several cars

 and the lowest drag---aero and drive train

[Kiwi Paul]

Yep, I remember that 432 pass well, it was `91 and we set our FCC record that year. The pits were down by the Start line, and I was standing on top of Chuck Freedluns enclosed trailer when Al came past, having started at the `0`.The sound that car made going by would make ALL the hairs on ALL your body parts stand up.....Brings up an interesting point though. If Al had 1600Hp, and Poteet/Main have at least 400 more, is it an Aero difference? I know the course was excellent that year. What about your car, Sparky?

[Mr411Fan]

I have a wonderful audio clip of one of those passes starting at the 0 and going by us on the starting line, you could hear the whole run and echoes between the shifts, seemed like you could hear him 5 miles away clear as a bell.

[Freud]

When Al shifted it was like waiting for the start of the second movement of a symphony.

FREUD

[Mr411Fan]

One comment I would like to add is:  The ability on a land speed vehicle to produce and transmit RELIABLE horspower.  In my mind the reasoning behind building multiple engine cars is not to make more power, but to have enough hp on tap as not to overstress the powerplant/drivetrain, and be able to make a return run. I'm not a fan of flat bottom cars, I like the cars that let some air under but manage it for an aero/downforce balance.

[Mr411Fan]

Oh, yeah, I'd have to agree with the symphony statment

[joea]

Freud...."When Al shifted it was like waiting for the start of the second movement of a symphony"

HAS to be one of or the BEST quotes in lsr history....!!!

[Freud]

When Nolan was recovering  he decided to quit thrashing the single engine so hard and run a pair. He chopped the frame in half,

stretched it, added the second engine and the blow up rate reduced severely.

We all know what he did after that.

FREUD

[jl222]

  The Land Speed Record book has the specs on the Goldenrod ...estimated weight  5500-6000 lb - area 9 sq ft
 coefficient of drag .117   4 engines at 600 hp each.
  Entering these specs in the Bonneville Pro computer program results in a 394 mph entering the 5th mile and   
419 at the end.

  I remember Als run in 91 but was that an average speed or exit speed? If average speed the hp was even more.

  Book also has Cobbs car with 2-- 1250 hp aero engines and 394 mph.

                 JL222

[k.h.]

Subsonic shapes work well at subsonic speeds.  Sonic shapes work best at sonic speeds.  There is a difference. 

[desotoman]

I think one thing that has contributed the most to seeing 4 cars run 400 in one week is Computers. Engine Management Systems. Engine and Suspension Data collecting systems. Traction Control etc.

Tom G.

[Freud]

and Dyno time.

FREUD