ceramic bearings and ball VS roller

[Jonny Hotnuts]

we have new spindles for the fronts. They are 54 chev and use ball bearings. We were told the ball bearings have a lower rolling resistance to roller.

Is there any truth to this?


I need to replace the bearings, and have heard some hype about ceramic bearings.
Is there any real world benefit to ceramics? (our spindles have 2 bearings per wheel, inside and out).
Dont want to spend the extra coin if they are snake oil.

~JH

[Gwillard]

The rotor bearings in the Bullet motor are ceramic. They are also $$$$$$  and can sometimes be difficult to get so we have to keep multiple spares on hand.

[wolbrink471]

Dont want to spend the extra coin if they are snake oil.

~JH

There are ceramic wheel bearings in the wheels of the dirt bike....nothing scientific, but there is substancially less rolling resistance compared to steel balls. Somebody will gently 'pull' the wheel a quarter turn and it generally spins longer than the rest of out attention spans!

Mark

[Stainless1]

Ceramic bearings should be good for an extra .0005 MPH at a hundred.... less at 2.... with all the extra speed be sure your tail hook works 

[fredvance]

While playing with my bearings and seals, it seemed like there is as much or more to be gained from trimming away the seal lip where it touches. Yes I can drink a cup of coffee waiting for the front wheel to stop spinning, but I couldnt before I trimmed the seals. The dragracers dont use seals and I dont when running the mile but not a good idea on the salt. Oh yeah I do run ceramic bearings in the wheels and the motor.

  Fred

[ack]

Ceramic bearings should be good for an extra .0005 MPH at a hundred.... less at 2.... with all the extra speed be sure your tail hook works 

Stainless I think you estimates are a little optimistic but you forgot ceramic bearings are effective at reducing weight of the vehicle if you carry your wallet in the vehicle when it is running.

[Rex Schimmer]

JHT,
I think your question was: Are ball bearing lower friction than roller bearings"? The answer is yes, ball bearings do have lower rolling resistance than roller bearings i.e. Timken bearings. The real kicker is the wording "when properly applied" . Ceramic bearings are even better, they have less rolling resistance and typically have a greater load capacity, and Fred hit the nail on the head regarding the biggest resistance being the seals.

Rex

[Black Rose Racing]

 This may or may not be relevant to LSR (You be the judge) A while back a friend who owns an Aerospace bearing supply company gave me a few sets of ceramic bearings for my racing and pool boards -  608's (yes I still skateboard pools,parks and Downhill race every chance I get, @ 50yrs. old)
  Point being, though not scientific by any means when I put a set of Ceramics on my pool deck and dropped in. The Ceramic bearings were absolutely faster than my favorite well broken in, perfectly oiled German (Brand) 608's so much so that I had to relax (NOT pump) to keep from flying out of the pool. Impressed? yes, seat of the pants observation ? yes.

  Then I installed sets on my Slalom race deck and my downhill speed deck. running my fastest, most expensive set of conventional bearings against new sets of ceramics, same day and same equipment. On a 55 Cone GS course (little over 1/8 mi) I picked up 1.6 seconds over my fastest time w/ steel bearings. On my Downhill deck again, all things equal same day,same conditions on the downhill course. Fastest MPH on conventional bearings 58.31mph. Fastest MPH on Ceramics 66.72 MPH. Keep in mind that these were brand new out of the box bearings w/ factory shipping lube. After cleaning,re lube and break in these ceramics continue to get faster and faster.

  Fred V. and I had this conversation at WF and came to the same conclusion. I could go on, but my mind is made up.   


 

[fredvance]

I read somewhere, maybe here, that some one did comparison runs, on a bike at around 200mph and picked up 2mph with the ceramic bearings.

  Fred

[Dean Los Angeles]

It depends on what steel ball bearing you are using for comparison.

I used to have some mini bike jackshaft bearings that effectively had no tolerance. A lumpy rock would have been an improvement.

Bearing dimensions are rated for precision by the Annular Bearing Engineers Committee (ABEC).
The higher the ABEC number, the more precise the bearing and the less it will deviate from its (ideal)
stated dimensions. In other words, the higher the number the better the bearing. For example:
ABEC-5 bearings have tighter tolerances than ABEC-1 bearings.

Ceramic bearings are the best, but they can be a budget buster. ABEC-7 bearings can be almost as expensive.

Timken roller bearings are used in spindle applications because they are designed to take both horizontal and vertical loading. Ball bearings won't take much of a side load.

[4-barrel Mike]

I'm not a Chevy guy, but it seems to me that the first thing that Chevy guys do in hi-pro (street) situations is to replace the ball bearings with roller.  Reliability issues??

Mike

[mtkawboy]

My first car was a 54 Chevy, no reliability issues IF you keep them packed frequently. Yes if you dont.

[fredvance]

I talked to a Timken(sp) rep one time and he told me that adjustment was as important lube. Alittle too tight and they will fail pretty quick, a little too loose really wont hurt, as long as it is not so loose it is hammering around.

  Fred

[johnneilson]

Ceramic bearings, fun.
Yes, ball bearing have less contact area and do theoretically have less resistance. The application is a major factor.

While working for Saint Gobain, I did quite a bit of testing with ceramics in ball bearings. Making hybrid bearings with cages and full compliment styles.
For the most part, the hybrids did reduce some parsitic drag. The comparisons were done without seals and used shields or open types.

We ran bearings 6205 up to 19,500 rpm without any failures, however we did have some inner race failures when the shaft speeds changed too quickly. (on the full compliment styles)

Are they worth the money? you bet, but they are like any other bearing, neglect them and they will fail.

John

[racer x]

just a hint for all those guys running production motorcycles. Check out how much drag is in a speedometer cable and drive.
One other thing that the ceramic bearings have going for them is they don't rust .I guess the races will but you cant have everything.