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Author Topic: firewall forward frame design  (Read 10270 times)
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Jonny Hotnuts
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« Reply #30 on: October 24, 2007, 07:25:26 PM »

What is the point in having a MS class if you can only stretch the front to 130” and change the motor manufacture?

Really takes the “Modified” of MS.

Too bad I could not add a back seat and enter in CC or maybe a new class called Comp Sports!!!

(I think that this rule affecting only MS and not CC is BS. To me MS is the CC of the sports car and the rules basically parallel, a rule such as this should affect both.)
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"Sometimes it is impossible to deal with her, but most of the time she is very sweet, and if you caress her properly she will sing beautifully."
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Sumner
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« Reply #31 on: October 24, 2007, 07:57:48 PM »

What is the point in having a MS class if you can only stretch the front to 130” and change the motor manufacture?

Really takes the “Modified” of MS.

Too bad I could not add a back seat and enter in CC or maybe a new class called Comp Sports!!!

(I think that this rule affecting only MS and not CC is BS. To me MS is the CC of the sports car and the rules basically parallel, a rule such as this should affect both.)


Personally I don't think you are gaining that much by trying to make the very front so narrow.  You still have the frontal area as the widest part of the car. Go back to what Tom and I talked to you about making it similar to the Blowfish.  Since you can tuck each side in 3 inches and you can run a narrower tire than stock (remember you are measuring from the tire center to center) you should be able to close the wheel openings if you want.  You don't need much of a turn radius there.  Go out on the highway with your street car and turn the wheel one inch and see what a drastic change of direction that is.

Don't get discouraged, you will be fine, and remember you set a record where there was no record before, so everyone who tries to go after your record will have to play by the same rules,

Sum
« Last Edit: October 24, 2007, 08:19:30 PM by Sumner » Logged

JackD
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« Reply #32 on: October 24, 2007, 08:05:56 PM »

MS, CC, and MR front ends are all in the same boat.
One little navigation error will really get you off course.
Now after being lost at sea it is tough to get back. wink
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sockjohn
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« Reply #33 on: October 24, 2007, 08:45:48 PM »

What is the point in having a MS class if you can only stretch the front to 130” and change the motor manufacture?

Really takes the “Modified” of MS.

Too bad I could not add a back seat and enter in CC or maybe a new class called Comp Sports!!!

(I think that this rule affecting only MS and not CC is BS. To me MS is the CC of the sports car and the rules basically parallel, a rule such as this should affect both.)


Personally I don't think you are gaining that much by trying to make the very front so narrow.  You still have the frontal area as the widest part of the car. Go back to what Tom and I talked to you about making it similar to the Blowfish.  Since you can tuck each side in 3 inches and you can run a narrower tire than stock (remember you are measuring from the tire center to center) you should be able to close the wheel openings if you want.  You don't need much of a turn radius there.  Go out on the highway with your street car and turn the wheel one inch and see what a drastic change of direction that is.

Don't get discouraged, you will be fine, and remember you set a record where there was no record before, so everyone who tries to go after your record will have to play by the same rules,

Sum

I think this is dead on.  If you look at an "ideal" nose shape, it's not a pointy triangle Smiley

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« Reply #34 on: October 24, 2007, 10:12:16 PM »

Maybe a "pointy triangle' isn't for landspeed racing, but I'd confirm that with Area 51 folks, 2 B sure!
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Jonny Hotnuts
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« Reply #35 on: October 25, 2007, 06:20:07 PM »

Quote
Personally I don't think you are gaining that much by trying to make the very front so narrow.  You still have the frontal area as the widest part of the car


Smaller front end = reduction of wetted surface resulting in better Cd.

Smaller front end = ability to have smoother transition to the stock body and maintain a linear flow without separation of the boundary layer.

Smaller front end cross sectional area = improvement in CP and better lateral stability.


Only thing a minimum track rule will do is make my car longer.




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Unkl Ian
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« Reply #36 on: October 26, 2007, 09:08:41 AM »

How does a narrow front end improve Center of Pressure ?
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Jonny Hotnuts
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« Reply #37 on: October 26, 2007, 11:30:32 AM »

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Smaller front end cross sectional area = improvement in CP and better lateral stability.

More narrow will not but smaller side surface area will.

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jonny_hotnuts@hotmail.com

"Sometimes it is impossible to deal with her, but most of the time she is very sweet, and if you caress her properly she will sing beautifully."
*Andres Segovia
(when Im not working on the car, I am ususally playing classical guitar)
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« Reply #38 on: October 26, 2007, 07:07:32 PM »

Mr Hotnuts has had to re-explain himself. The key word a couple of posts back was "Wetted Area"- I recommend Prof. Katz book for explanation of terms- it reads pretty easy. In fact Paul Glessner uses it in his aerodynamic seminars as the text.

That comment re: wetted area got me thinkin'...good thing at my age ..but OF COURSE it does and therefore enhances the CP/CG correct relationship. Makes the back half more of a fin because it leaves more body bulk back there..



"It's just a box with five strings and a neck" - Julian Bream
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Jonny Hotnuts
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« Reply #39 on: October 26, 2007, 07:48:21 PM »

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"It's just a box with five strings and a neck" - Julian Bream

Julian is a bird of a diffrent feather....so old now, doent play anymore.
Still likes to have a few beers at the local pub from what I hear.

Not sure what he was meaning with the quote.....guitars have 6 strings....maybe he also had a banjo laying around we didnt know about.

I learned alot from Bream......
I transcribed his version of the rondo in Am by Dionisio Aguado (considered by some to be his hallmark piece and what I usually finish a concert with).

Here is Bream and my transcription:

http://www.classtab.org/da_r_am.txt

http://youtube.com/watch?v=k_ItONyor04




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jonny_hotnuts@hotmail.com

"Sometimes it is impossible to deal with her, but most of the time she is very sweet, and if you caress her properly she will sing beautifully."
*Andres Segovia
(when Im not working on the car, I am ususally playing classical guitar)
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« Reply #40 on: October 26, 2007, 08:19:09 PM »

havin' fun with you Hotnuts as I hope you know- great that we can all come together and yet have many different "passions"

I'm about to out on the patio and turn on KUSC  (LA's ONLY classical station, now  and have my evening beer>-Thanks for the references.-They don't play enough of your -type stuff.

got two-three more sign-offs after Bream- hope you'll enjoy!
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« Reply #41 on: October 26, 2007, 08:34:04 PM »

P.S to the last- Should have quoted Peabody, not Bream-blew my cover- I'm a listener, NOT a PLAYER! will pass your transcription on, though.
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