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Author Topic: 1000cc MPG or A/PG questions for WOS  (Read 1558 times)
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real norton
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« Reply #15 on: October 09, 2017, 10:35:29 PM »

  Actually Joe just gave You some really Good advice
 As bad as Bville is getting and as bad as El  Mirage can get You need suspension.
 As many thoughts as You have a rule book wont be your salvation.
 You need to get in touch with Matt Schuss, He is a member here and He knows all the answers.
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Unforgiven
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« Reply #16 on: October 09, 2017, 11:01:00 PM »

Thanks for the advise. I am looking at just modifying the engine keeping the stock appearing suspension, but already I am getting confused by the classes and rules. Seems P-PP fits my idea and parts pile the best. I really don't want to modify the frame. According to P-PP a buell has the record in the 1000cc class at 144 and some change.  Looks attainable. I know the bike Nahlin did the heads for was an 883 punched to 1000cc in 2001 and it ran in P-PP
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Stainless1
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« Reply #17 on: October 10, 2017, 09:07:47 AM »

It will be easier to understand when you read all the rules.  Production must appear to be a factory stock bike... Modified allows all kinds of external changes... both allow internal changes...
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Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, MSA Bockscar Lakester with a little N20 
MSA Bockscar Lakester #1000 my fastest mile 245 and change, 84 ci turbobusa motor... but Corey's 233 MPH H/BFL record is still 3MPH faster than mine.
Frank06
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« Reply #18 on: October 10, 2017, 10:41:38 AM »

It will be easier to understand when you read all the rules.  Production must appear to be a factory stock bike... Modified allows all kinds of external changes... both allow internal changes...
I would second Joe's suggestion to use rear suspension unless you are going to race on pavement. 

Sent from my MotoE2(4G-LTE) using Tapatalk

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Unforgiven
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« Reply #19 on: October 10, 2017, 05:07:40 PM »

It will be easier to understand when you read all the rules.  Production must appear to be a factory stock bike... Modified allows all kinds of external changes... both allow internal changes...

Ah, ok. Then Production P-PP is what I want to build for. As I want to keep the bike stock looking.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2017, 05:09:29 PM by Unforgiven » Logged
Stan Back
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« Reply #20 on: October 10, 2017, 05:26:37 PM »

Good choice.  But if you don't do something to increase your inches, you'll have the smallest PP at the meet.  Stretch it out.  Don't get caught with that little thing. (Don't worry, you probably won't make it to Impound where someone will actually measure it.)

Good luck!
Stan Back   
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mtiberio
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« Reply #21 on: October 10, 2017, 05:43:17 PM »

Production also means stock mufflers (externally) and stock Air box (filter can be mia)
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Unforgiven
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« Reply #22 on: October 10, 2017, 08:18:29 PM »

Good choice.  But if you don't do something to increase your inches, you'll have the smallest PP at the meet.  Stretch it out.  Don't get caught with that little thing. (Don't worry, you probably won't make it to Impound where someone will actually measure it.)

Good luck!
Stan Back   

See. A sense of humor is better than knowledge sometimes. I caught on after the second read and then spit beer on the screen.  cheers If I run faster than 144 and change (what I read record for P-PP 1000cc is by Jdees Performance Buell) won't I have to go to impound, I mean if I can squeeze 145 or so out of hopped up heavy assed rubbermount.  And that is what bothers me...I have gone over 130 on a hot rod sportster in way less than a mile; So, what is it that makes it so difficult. I have been drag racing sportsters for over 40 years, and I always wondered about the speeds at Bonneville. I told a friend that I would need to go over 144 with my build and he said that was slow.
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Unforgiven
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« Reply #23 on: October 10, 2017, 08:24:09 PM »

Production also means stock mufflers (externally) and stock Air box (filter can be mia)

Besides the top gas bike I never race anymore; Most of my drag bikes have been stock appearing modified bike classes. I know most of the tricks related to sportsters . I just can't figure out why it would be so hard to go over 144 with a 1000cc built and tricked sportster. I have gone a shade over 132 with a slightly hopped up sportster. And it didn't take 3 miles. Do we run three miles ? I don't understand why it would be so difficult. The salt ? The course? I have never been there live. Looking forward to it.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2017, 08:29:44 PM by Unforgiven » Logged
Vinsky
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« Reply #24 on: October 10, 2017, 09:25:10 PM »

Production also means stock mufflers (externally) and stock Air box (filter can be mia)

Besides the top gas bike I never race anymore; Most of my drag bikes have been stock appearing modified bike classes. I know most of the tricks related to sportsters . I just can't figure out why it would be so hard to go over 144 with a 1000cc built and tricked sportster. I have gone a shade over 132 with a slightly hopped up sportster. And it didn't take 3 miles. Do we run three miles ? I don't understand why it would be so difficult. The salt ? The course? I have never been there live. Looking forward to it.
Not too many drag bikes will last 3-5 miles wide open, and where traction (loose salt) is a big factor. Oh, and try to do this at 4200 to 7000 ft density altitude.  A true adventure.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2017, 09:26:50 PM by Vinsky » Logged

John
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« Reply #25 on: October 10, 2017, 10:02:15 PM »

And remember it's not an instantaneous speed reading, but rather the average speed over a mile.  shocked shocked shocked

Pete
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« Reply #26 on: October 10, 2017, 10:10:30 PM »

Production also means stock mufflers (externally) and stock Air box (filter can be mia)

Besides the top gas bike I never race anymore; Most of my drag bikes have been stock appearing modified bike classes. I know most of the tricks related to sportsters . I just can't figure out why it would be so hard to go over 144 with a 1000cc built and tricked sportster. I have gone a shade over 132 with a slightly hopped up sportster. And it didn't take 3 miles. Do we run three miles ? I don't understand why it would be so difficult. The salt ? The course? I have never been there live. Looking forward to it.
Not too many drag bikes will last 3-5 miles wide open, and where traction (loose salt) is a big factor. Oh, and try to do this at 4200 to 7000 ft density altitude.  A true adventure.

I knew there was way more to it than just haulin' the mail. I know a team that races Buells and they said it is sometimes like riding on ball bearings. I believe this is gonna be just what I need to do
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Unforgiven
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« Reply #27 on: October 10, 2017, 10:18:47 PM »

Trying to post picture, but can't figure it out
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Unforgiven
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« Reply #28 on: October 10, 2017, 10:21:47 PM »

And remember it's not an instantaneous speed reading, but rather the average speed over a mile.  shocked shocked shocked

Pete

Ah ha. That is the reason it is so difficult, well I imagine a major part of it.
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mtiberio
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« Reply #29 on: October 11, 2017, 07:55:15 AM »

So at the risk of inviting competition, here are the 1000cc pushrod records at Bonneville (and El Mirage):

Bonneville:
P-PP  buell 144
M-PG guzzi 158 (no aero, amazing number really)
M-PF h-d 150
A-PG guzzi 151
A-PF h-d 167 (someone in the F class actually running fuel?)
MPS-PG guzzi 170
MPS-PF buell 181 (ditto on the fuel)
APS-PG guzzi 171
APS-PF guzzi 170 (obviously the gas bike with mods to pass fuel tech)

El Mirage:
P-PP unknown 138
M-PG guzzi 142 (my record)
M-PF unset 137 (minimum, maybe I'll go after this next year)
A-PG unknown 154
A-PF unknown 169
MPS-PG unset 144 (minimum, I'm going for this next week)
MPS-PF unset 151 (minimum)
APS-PG guzzi 161
APS-PF unknown 165

My 1000cc motor is an old road race motor, not a drag race motor. The only way I could possibly think about trying to match the M-PG speed (158) from Bonneville would be with a new 90+ HP motor (~$10K). YM(PH)MV...

This sport is a lot harder than I thought it would be. Consistency is the key. I have had a total of 9 runs to date (I'm a rookie this year), and I have only had one run close to my best (backed up the 142 with a 141). Otherwise I can drop as low as 131 or run 136 if I pick the wrong jetting or gearing, but sometimes I have no reason for why I'm slow (or fast for that matter). Run Bonneville if you want the mystique (and corrosion), but El Mirage offers more opportunities to run per year, and on vehicles with low records, the shorter length is not a hindrance.

In case you haven't been paying attention, El Mirage added over 300 M classes last winter, and set (what I believe to be) low minimums. I decided to run last winter before I had heard about the new classes, and figured I'd have to run A. Once they announced the M classes, but hadn't yet published minimums, I figured the minimum for M-PG at ElMo would be about 150 (looking at the other 1000 pushrod classes at ElMo and Bonne). As it is they set it to 130, I went 129 my rookie weekend, 136 the next, and 142 the next. I appear to have stalled there, and so I'm adding some aero for next weekend and will go after the MPS-PG record. Come out, have fun, just stay behind me...  8^))

« Last Edit: October 11, 2017, 07:58:28 AM by mtiberio » Logged

Every programmer occasionally, opens up a file on their computer. Sometimes they wrote it, or they found it and knew they had to save it. They read over the lines, and weep at their beauty. This file is Good Code. It has sensible names for functions and variables. It's concise. It has never had to answer to a sales team. It does exactly one thing, and it does it well. It reads like poetry.
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