Landracing Forum Home
October 20, 2017, 09:33:03 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News:
BACK TO LANDRACING.COM HOMEPAGE
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  


(Note: Donations are not tax deductible)







Live Audio Streaming and Archives of Past Events
Next Live Event: TBD
Pages: [1] 2   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: need some help on using the C4 in my roadster  (Read 1050 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Happy Pappy
New folks

Offline Offline

Age: 60
Location: So. Cal. High Desert
Posts: 16




Ignore
« on: September 10, 2017, 07:35:29 PM »

Hey All,
Pretty new to this, been trying to get an answer but so far Nada. So here goes...
If I am using the C4, no torque converter, reverse shift pattern, rollerized etc. So I get pushed off the line in neutral get up to speed, 1st. 2nd. 3rd. and through the lights. So now what? can't simply shut off I will torch the transmission bearings. Cant just back off the throttle compression would cause the rear to come around (El Mirage), thought about pull chute then back-off??
Now here is what I have been told, You can pull back through 3rd.,2nd.,1st. and Neutral quickly (non-ratchet type) and that it should be fine.. Not super comfy with that but so far I have not figured this one out. What would be nice is N 1 2 3 N.
So anyone out there using the C4?

Thanks Guys,
Chris
Logged

“We must reject the idea that every time a law's broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions.”

- Ronald Reagan
kiwi belly tank
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Age: 166
Location: Lava Hot Springs Idaho
Posts: 2220




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2017, 07:55:57 PM »

With a direct drive you need to run a clutch type flywheel so you can pull your foot out of it during or after a run & not lock up the rear tires. A standard pattern valve body is better then you can go from 3 to N after you're on the laundry. If you want to kill the engine while still making speed you'll need a lube pump, either a belt drive off the back of the trans or an electric unit.
  Sid.
Logged
ronnieroadster
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Location: Connecticut
Posts: 532





Ignore
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2017, 08:28:00 PM »

Chris
 Like Sid said standard shift pattern.
    I originally ran a C-4 with the reverse valve body left over from my drag racing days. First ever inspection of my LSR car the tech guys put me in the car and watched me shift during an imaginary run while just standing still. I shifted 1-2-3 then they said ok now you just completed the run go to neutral. Well as you wrote only the way to neutral is downshifting and that my friend is dangerous that will cause the rear tires to lock up which is not safe as was also pointed out by the tech guys during my inital inspection. My C-4 after that was converted to a manual valve body with a standard shift pattern after a run you can go directly from third to neutral.
   My C-4 combination for the last six years including at Speedweek 2017 has worked perfectly. This year every pass was over 200 with a final class record of 225.003 that's in three miles with a torque converter and no push off.  
   With the no torque converter coasting in neutral after a pass should work fine. But whatever you do don't flat tow the car for any great distance if you do the rear tail housing bushing is sure to get damaged since its not getting any lube.
 If you need a standard manual valve body I have an extra in stock.
 Ronnieroadster
  
« Last Edit: September 10, 2017, 08:34:39 PM by ronnieroadster » Logged

Working in the shop I use the 'F' word a lot. No not that word these words Focus and Finish go Fast and Flathead Ford!
 ECTA  XF/BGRMR Record 179.8561
 LTA    XF/BGRMR  Record 186.946
 SCTA  XF/BGRMR Record 192.448
 SCTA  XXF/BGRMR Record 216.131 plus a Red Had
Happy Pappy
New folks

Offline Offline

Age: 60
Location: So. Cal. High Desert
Posts: 16




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2017, 08:36:53 AM »

Totally understand the forward shift pattern, makes complete sense after the run. So how do you start when being pushed off? In 1st?

Thank you for your reply's

Chris
Logged

“We must reject the idea that every time a law's broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions.”

- Ronald Reagan
Happy Pappy
New folks

Offline Offline

Age: 60
Location: So. Cal. High Desert
Posts: 16




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2017, 08:40:59 AM »

Almost forgot... "Clutch type flywheel"?? Can you point me in a direction, never heard of that for an automatic trans.

Thank you Sid,
Chris
Logged

“We must reject the idea that every time a law's broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions.”

- Ronald Reagan
RichFox
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Location: San Mateo, Ca
Posts: 2418





Ignore
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2017, 09:47:33 AM »

Rick Yacoucci has a C4 and is in your area. Have you asked him?
Logged
Happy Pappy
New folks

Offline Offline

Age: 60
Location: So. Cal. High Desert
Posts: 16




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2017, 10:22:20 AM »

Googled him... Thank you.

Chris
Logged

“We must reject the idea that every time a law's broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions.”

- Ronald Reagan
Calkins
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Age: 34
Location: Iowa Falls, Iowa USA
Posts: 518


On Any Sunday


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2017, 10:58:18 AM »

I have a C4 that my machine shop had tried in a dirt car.  He put a hand valve on it with a fake (direct drive) convertor.  A hose comes off the pump, threw the hand valve, and dumps into the pan.  Other than that, I know nothing about it.  Companies like TCI sell kits with a hand or foot (pedal) valve for Powerglides.  Would that work?
Logged

Justin Calkins - Iowa Falls, Iowa  USA
kiwi belly tank
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Age: 166
Location: Lava Hot Springs Idaho
Posts: 2220




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2017, 11:01:37 AM »

Almost forgot... "Clutch type flywheel"?? Can you point me in a direction, never heard of that for an automatic trans.

Thank you Sid,
Chris
An auto "flex" plate is a floppy bitch without a converter bolted to it plus it has no flywheel effect by it's self, you can get that back with a clutch type flywheel. The TCI drive has multiple snap ring grooves for different spacing positions, if it's still too long you'll have to put a spacer between the engine & trans, just like a block protector plate. Also by the rules you will need a flywheel shield & a planetary trans shield or blanket.
  Sid.
Logged
Happy Pappy
New folks

Offline Offline

Age: 60
Location: So. Cal. High Desert
Posts: 16




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2017, 11:33:10 AM »

OK Now I get the clutch type flywheel smiley Unfortunately TCI is pretty much powerglide only for that particular product., "Not for a C-4".
Yeah we got the blanket covered.
Talked with Rick, super nice guy need to introduce my self to him at the next El Mo Run. He suggest to just run a torque converter. Makes sense for El Mirage, no push off therefore getting the power down in a shorter distance + Engine harmonic transfer deadened with a fluid coupling. Just going to leave some HP on the table.
Been trying for a week or so to get hold of  Pro Trans in Lancaster no luck as of yet. Been told he may have some answers also.

Thank you all for the help, still need to figure out whats gonna work.

Chris
Logged

“We must reject the idea that every time a law's broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions.”

- Ronald Reagan
Calkins
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Age: 34
Location: Iowa Falls, Iowa USA
Posts: 518


On Any Sunday


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2017, 11:57:18 AM »

I have been doing a bunch of research the past year or so on building a drag race C4.  Everything I have read points to Performance Automatic being the go to guys for Ford automatics.  But, there is always someone that offers this part or that part that is better.

http://www.performanceautomatic.com
Logged

Justin Calkins - Iowa Falls, Iowa  USA
Happy Pappy
New folks

Offline Offline

Age: 60
Location: So. Cal. High Desert
Posts: 16




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2017, 12:07:50 PM »

I had talked with Bill at performance and he had nothing that would give me the neutral without running back through the gears.

Chris
Logged

“We must reject the idea that every time a law's broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions.”

- Ronald Reagan
Calkins
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Age: 34
Location: Iowa Falls, Iowa USA
Posts: 518


On Any Sunday


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2017, 01:11:14 PM »

The Kent Fuller streamliner runs a shorty C4.  But, I have no contact info for anyone on the team.  Just a thought...

http://www.kentfullerstreamliner.com

« Last Edit: September 11, 2017, 07:55:16 PM by Calkins » Logged

Justin Calkins - Iowa Falls, Iowa  USA
kiwi belly tank
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Age: 166
Location: Lava Hot Springs Idaho
Posts: 2220




Ignore
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2017, 05:41:06 PM »

I had talked with Bill at performance and he had nothing that would give me the neutral without running back through the gears.

Chris
If you shut the engine off in any gear you're going to have neutral.
  Sid.
Logged
NathanStewart
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Age: 36
Location: So Cal
Posts: 1166





Ignore
« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2017, 02:32:51 PM »

We run a C4 with no torque converter.  We push off in neutral, drop it in to gear and go 1-2-3 and then roll it back into neutral in one motion at the end of the run.  Ratchet shifter won't work.  In the old car we just had a lever with no real shift mechanism.  You just moved it and could feel the detents.  Worked okay but you could misshift pretty easily.  New car has someone's off the shelf shifter in it and out of the box, it wouldn't have worked.  My brother had a customer shift gate plate made and now we can do what I described above.  Works great.  He'll sell you a shift gate if you need one.
Logged

El Mirage 200 MPH Club Member
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
Simple Audio Video Embedder
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!


Google visited last this page October 16, 2017, 06:54:11 AM