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Author Topic: Frame Issue  (Read 10726 times)
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panic
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« Reply #45 on: October 11, 2016, 01:40:20 PM »

I've been building, tuning and writing about flathead H-D engines since 1968, and in my opinion there is nothing significantly different between a legal (pre-1956) and an actual 1956 KHK engine. Some of my work on this and other subjects appears on Wikipedia. I'll be happy to furnish a notarized statement to that effect if it will help.
Some of my published work:
http://www.victorylibrary.com/books1.htm
Some of my public service (a.k.a., free) work:
http://www.victorylibrary.com/tech/tech.htm
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56KHK
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« Reply #46 on: October 15, 2016, 04:50:04 PM »

I have most of your books, maybe all of them.  You sir, have been my guru for many a year.  Your website has entertained me many a dark night.  I have followed your advice for many years, and it has served me well.  You are quite famous in my corner of the Harley Flathead world.

As it turns out, my belly numbers indicate a manufacturing date in 1955, but your offer is greatly appreciated and may yet be needed.

Thank you, sir.

Jim Tarleton cheers

PS
You once had some serious data about blown bikes on your website, but I can no longer find it.  Can I buy it?
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56KHK
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« Reply #47 on: May 08, 2017, 08:13:24 AM »

I haven't posted in a long time.  I will try to catch up.  I am actually running three projects, 1) Bought a RV to make the trip and had to do maintenance work on it like replacing the in-tank fuel pump.  I am doing 100% of all work by myself, so time becomes a serious issue.  2) Getting my old Jeep CJ7 in shape to be the chase vehicle.  Bike will mount on the back of the Jeep for the trip out and back on a custom built bike caddy I modified to fit into the tow receiver hitch.  RV will tow Jeep.  More work and lost time.  3)Final plan for bike finalized and mock up started.  My work plan may be a bit odd to some, but I get it done.  The pictures show a rusty frame, etc.  All beautification will take place during the painting phase (yep, I will do that also).  I have had some wonderful help from Patrick (French Owl) who diverted me from a failed path many times, Don Rothwell, who built a coupe of much needed handmade pieces, modified my S&S fuel carb for methanol (lots of it), and a host of others to which I am indebted.  I took a month hiatus from the bike construction to take care of other issues that had to be done (RV and Jeep).  I am mocking up the bike as of now, in its final form before blasting and painting.

The blower installation and intake system took many forms before I decided on what you will see.  I modified a turbo flutter valve to be a pop-off valve (open x-section area is slightly more than I calculated I would need), and I found a new aluminum tig guy to weld up the whole thing after I did the fitting by hand.  It is amazing how 1/4" clearance here and an 1/8" clearance there can complicate an install.  I installed a steel Blast Box to protect my nuts in case of a catastrophic blower failure.  I spent more time than expected on the blower belt drive setup because I had to do the design and verification myself.  My local industrial suppliers had very little knowledge about their products - and I mean very little.  That has been a problem from the beginning.  I became disgusted with my local Gates rep very quickly.  What happened to the old sales guys who knew their products from top to bottom?  Asking one of them to calculate anything is like asking them to run with the bulls.

Mine is but a meager effort to run fast and safe.  It is way more complex than I initially thought.  Of course, I am preaching to the choir.  I do admit I have spent a lot of money, but I have enjoyed the process immensely.  I have salt fever more than ever.

Jim cheers


* Mock Up Right Side View of Intake System 1 R.jpg (169.56 KB, 500x281 - viewed 116 times.)

* Mock Up Rear View 4R.jpg (120.82 KB, 282x500 - viewed 86 times.)

* Mock Up of Right Side of Intake System 2 R.jpg (170.01 KB, 500x320 - viewed 91 times.)
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Seldom Seen Slim
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« Reply #48 on: May 08, 2017, 09:29:01 AM »

Jim, it looks like you're having lots of fun.  I do wanna ask, though, if you've got pictures of the other right side of the bike.  Just askin'...

Welcome back to active Forum participation.  Keep posting. . . grin
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Jon E. Wennerberg
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SPARKY
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« Reply #49 on: May 08, 2017, 10:36:10 AM »

"What happened to the old sales guys who knew their products from top to bottom?  Asking one of them to calculate anything is like asking them to run with the bulls".

More and more I am finding that the most knowledgeable sales person in most chain auto parts stores is a "Bull" who takes pride in know more than the guys!! I have one at Auto Zone and one at O Riley's that I go to
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WhizzbangK.C.
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« Reply #50 on: May 08, 2017, 12:10:59 PM »

I became disgusted with my local Gates rep very quickly.  What happened to the old sales guys who knew their products from top to bottom?  Asking one of them to calculate anything is like asking them to run with the bulls.

Litigation is what happened. If they do the calculations for you, and something fails, it's their fault. Even if you gave them incorrect or incomplete information about the application, you might come back on them over it. It's not right, but it is the way the world is now.  cry
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Ah, this is obviously some strange usage of the word 'safe' that I wasn't previously aware of.  Douglas Adams
manta22
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« Reply #51 on: May 08, 2017, 12:23:57 PM »

Maybe Shakespeare was right. Henry VI, part 2 Act 4, Scene 2.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
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Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Ron Gibson
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« Reply #52 on: May 08, 2017, 01:19:33 PM »

Part is fear of litigation, part is shear stupidity and lack of common sense. The only thing they know is computers, if it's not there, your out of luck.  I was told at an OReilly that if I didn't have the year and model he couldn't help me. With the old crap I work on that is hilariousy funny.

Ron
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panic
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« Reply #53 on: May 08, 2017, 02:49:11 PM »

If the engine's angle to the horizontal plane is correct in the photos, your oil drain in the floor of the right crankcase to the return pump will not be the lowest point, and some oil will pool under the #1 and 2 (rear cylinder) camshafts. This may cause them to churn through the liquid, and although not a major parasitic drag will tend to aerate the oil, and reduce the efficiency of the return gears. There may be enough room to raise the floor in the rear of the chest to improve the natural drain.
Are you confident that the float bowl angle as shown will insure the right fuel depth of the main nozzle, etc?
I would not end the air horn pointing rearward, but end in a box with its entry in still air to avoid weird air correction changes with MPH.
Have you decided in breather timing yet?
« Last Edit: May 08, 2017, 02:51:38 PM by panic » Logged
56KHK
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« Reply #54 on: May 08, 2017, 04:54:44 PM »

The bike is sitting on a trailer that has it tongue sitting on a block.  The engine/trans will be dead level with the horizon, as will the carb; and the carb will sport an air filter (K&N) that resides in a Dead Air Box sitting inside the fairing.  Ground clearance will be less than 3"by design.  That may turn out to be too low, as surface texture at BSF is one of the unknowns to me.  The carb will be level if I have to cut and refit/weld the runner.

Picking my oil pump and setting breather timing was the first project phase I did.  I am using a particular setup that I decided on after reading everything I could find on oiling and breather timing, including your recommendations for the big flatties, although not directly related to the KHK.  From just recall, I have a 72 pump, a couple of racing pumps, and a bag of parts and springs.  I have limited experience with changing breather events, so I will rely heavily on outside recommendations.  I would greatly value any recommendation from you.   

                             
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TheBaron
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« Reply #55 on: May 08, 2017, 07:23:11 PM »

I've been running a small (350cc) blown pushrod vee-twin since 2013, and the Aisin blower works well if set up properly...

I don't know how much boost pressure you are planing to run, but 5 to 7.5 psi would be a good place to start....

Camshaft selection can be tricky, and wasted spark ignition can play havoc with everything...

If you have questions, I'll be glad advise...

Great project....

Robert "Smitty" Smith
The Baron Race Team

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generatorshovel
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« Reply #56 on: May 08, 2017, 08:51:58 PM »

Jim,
Try this contact , he was very helpful when I was in  setup mode.
PHILLIP AITKEN BEng (Mech)

Product Application Engineer

Industrial Replacement

paitken@gates.com
Tiny
« Last Edit: May 08, 2017, 09:07:20 PM by generatorshovel » Logged

Tiny (in OZ)
I would prefer to make horsepower, rather than buy, or hya it, regardless of the difficulties involved , as it would then be MINE
56KHK
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« Reply #57 on: May 09, 2017, 10:31:36 AM »

Thank you, Tiny.

Jim
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Pippi2
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« Reply #58 on: May 17, 2017, 08:48:40 PM »

I am a fresh face and a bit ignorant, awaiting arrival of my 2016 rule book.  I am building a blown fuel 56 KHK in an attempt to run in the MPS/VBF class.  Can I use a 1972 frame?  The only frame modification is altered front downcomer legs to accommodate the blower and a 3"-4" stretch of the rear swingarm.  I believe I have the option to lengthen the swingarm by 10% of the stock wheelbase.  The 1972 frame is my concern.

Jim Tarleton cheers

BMST 2017 Rule Book http://bonnevillespeedtrials.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/2017-AMA-BonnevilleSR-FINAL.pdf
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56KHK
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« Reply #59 on: May 21, 2017, 03:30:18 PM »

You are a sweetheart, and if that                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                avatar is your picture, a very attractive sweetheart at that.  Thank you.  I now have my reading for the night (and a few days hence).  What do I owe you?     

The ever grateful, Jim.

Jim         
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