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Author Topic: E-Busa  (Read 12874 times)
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manta22
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« Reply #30 on: November 09, 2014, 04:01:53 PM »

How about trying a compound- wound motor?

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
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Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Frank06
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« Reply #31 on: November 10, 2014, 07:45:44 PM »

Neil, I've never heard of one being used in a traction application.  Brushed series motors are used all the time because of their high starting torque and cost effectiveness.  They're great for drag racing but don't have the duty cycle to perform for extended periods of running at high output.  That said, John Metric has driven his Miata drag car to 165 mph at the Houston Mile.  That car (Assault & Battery) has twin 9" motors and he was running them at about 50% output.
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sabat
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« Reply #32 on: September 20, 2015, 08:52:28 PM »

Frank, did you make any passes at Loring this year? thanks, Dean
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Frank06
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« Reply #33 on: September 21, 2015, 07:06:04 AM »

Hi Dean,

I did, but not on this bike (I had that old "NAPA Green" H1.)  This bike now has a new motor, controller mods and a new battery pack which should be here in about a week.  I was planning to update the build thread after the batteries are installed.  Power with the mods should be ~220hp and a smaller battery pack will remove ~175#.  I was hoping to have the word done for the Harvest Event but couldn't get things together.  It's street legal so I hope to get some riding in this year.

Thanks for asking.

Frank
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sabat
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« Reply #34 on: September 21, 2015, 12:45:26 PM »

Great, I look forward to the updates.  cheers
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Mobacken Racing
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« Reply #35 on: September 21, 2015, 01:43:05 PM »

Really interesting project, it will be fun to follow your progress! smiley
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firemanjim
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« Reply #36 on: September 21, 2015, 05:55:32 PM »

Frank,looking for small 12 volt oil pump,what did you use for your bike?
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Bonneville 2001,2002,2003,2004,and NO stinking 2005,DLRA 2006, next?
Well,sure can't complain about 2008--6 records over 200 and 5 hats from Bonneville,Bubs, and El Mirage for the team!
Frank06
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« Reply #37 on: September 21, 2015, 07:05:26 PM »

First motor setup used this one:



http://www.lightobject.com/133Lm-210GPH-DC12V-Brushless-High-thrust-Water-Oil-pump-P659.aspx

I put an oil sump on that motor and this pumped oil (tranny fluid actually) through a small cooler and filter into the top of the motor pretty readily.  It draws about 2A.  I didn't want to modify the housing on the new motor and went with a turbo scavenge pump like this one:



It has to move enough oil out of the motor sump so it doesn't back up (just like on a turbo.)  I'm using the same pump to dump oil back into the top of the motor, bit of a balancing act really.  It draws more juice though (about 6A I think.)  I haven't actually run this as part of the system yet, just filled the motor and cooling system and circulated for awhile.  It seems to work alright but is louder than the first little pump.  Note: in these applications I'm not relying on oil being pressurized at all, just some volume of it moving through the system.  Oil removes heat and makes sure the roller bearings don't run dry.   cheers
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Frank06
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« Reply #38 on: October 13, 2015, 06:03:07 PM »

I finished my drag racing season this past Sunday so have some more time on my hands, might as well start updating this thread.

I had a good experience riding this bike last year but there were some obvious areas that needed improvement.  #1 was weight - it was hard to get an accurate measurement using the "big boy" bathroom scales I bought but it was at least 725#.  As I get older I prefer things a bit lighter!  #2 was power - while *very* torquey (300+ ft-lb) and a lot of fun to ride on the street, torque started cutting back around 70 mph and it really wasn't what I knew it could be.  Something else that was irritating was that I had limited lock-to-lock, fine for a race course but awkward on a street bike.

I started removing items, weighing them separately, then reweighing the bike in order to try to reconcile the totals.  I kept front and rear wheels level and weighed them independently.  I stripped off 280# of batteries and battery boxes alone!  While the old setup gave 100+ miles range on the street, it's more than I ever used.  I think I went 50 miles twice all last year.  I was pretty paranoid about keeping steel surrounding all the packs "just in case."  Ultimately I ended up with a rolling chassis that weighs about 235#.

The new setup uses a similar permanent magnet motor (Remy HVH250) but is parallel-wound (as opposed to the higher torque series-wound.)  I don't really understand what that means, just that the parallel motor can take a lot more current and output goes on longer.  Torque output is about 250 ft-lb but instead of starting to cut back at ~2600 rpm, it goes out to twice that.  According to Remy, power production should increase from ~100 kW (130 hp) to 180 kW (240 hp) with the controller mods I commissioned.
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Frank06
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« Reply #39 on: October 13, 2015, 06:10:59 PM »



Here's a shot of the new motor bolted down.  I had the new mounts (one on each end) waterjet cut out of .25" 6061 aluminum instead of the 1/4" steel plate used in the original build.  You can see the piece of 1/2" 6061 plate I used to support the motor mounts.  I drilled and tapped some 1/4-20 holes directly in this plate and bolted the sides down with grade 8 bolts.  You can also see some high-strength roll pins I used as dowels.  The whole rig sets on 1-1/2" square tubing I used in the original build, both to provide places to mount stuff and also to simulate the rigidity of the original engine.
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Frank06
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« Reply #40 on: October 13, 2015, 06:18:36 PM »



Similar construction on the drive end.
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Frank06
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« Reply #41 on: October 14, 2015, 10:04:59 AM »



Mostly completed drive end.  The "handle" shaped bracket is to make sure the sprocket doesn't come off should something go wrong with the shaft adapter.  The other piece of steel at the top (heading aft) is a torque arm.  I was able to mount this motor higher than the previous one which will allow me to use more regeneration.  I have a chain roller on the bottom of the chain path and even unloaded, the chain hardly touches it.  I only dialed-in enough regen with the previous setup to mimic engine braking.  The Rinehart controller will allow me to use variable regen should I so desire (I was uncomfortable exploring this option with a heavily loaded chain roller.)  Anti-squat might change too but I had preload dialed up a lot due to battery weight on the aft end of the bike.  I'll have to reset sag once I get everything back together.
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55chevr
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« Reply #42 on: October 14, 2015, 03:53:26 PM »

Frank ... can you dumb it down so a mechanical engineer can understand?


Joe
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Jessechop
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« Reply #43 on: October 14, 2015, 05:01:00 PM »

Regeneration is the ability to act like a generator when not under power....well at least I think. Its been awhile since I have messed with anything even remotely similar.
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Frank06
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« Reply #44 on: October 14, 2015, 05:29:29 PM »

Hi Guys,

Sorry 'bout that.  Regeneration is indeed using the motor as a generator to put electrons back into the battery.  It saves a bit of energy but really helps the brakes.  Our daughter is now driving our 2006 Prius and I didn't have to put pads on it until ~200K miles.  My understanding with some cars (like Tesla Model S) is that you can basically drive with one pedal.  I could set my controller up like that I think but I would never do it; too much risk of locking up the rear wheel.  It is possible to have a second throttle or some sort of switch to pull in more regen if conditions warrant it.

The reason I didn't use too much with the original setup was that I didn't want to load the idler wheel on the bottom chain run too highly.  It normally runs sloppy of course but under heavy engine braking or regen it tightens right up.

HTH
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